View Full Version : Craigslist hookers...
InkChic78
2009-09-15, 02:07 PM
They start off kinda cute...then ehhh, not so much...
Craigslist Hooker Sweep Nets 28 Women
Sheriff: Site remains "one-stop shop for all your prostitution needs"
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SEPTEMBER 15--Charging that Craigslist remains a "one-stop shop for all your prostitution needs," a Florida sheriff yesterday announced the arrest of 28 women who allegedly advertised sexual services on the popular online classifieds site. Dubbed "Operation Hot Date," the undercover police action also netted several pimps who worked with the alleged hookers, said Polk County Sheriff Grady Judd. The women, pictured in the mug shots on the following pages, offered a variety of sexual acts carrying prices between $125 and $800. Two of the alleged hookers who arrived for appointments with undercover officers were pregnant, and a third arrived with fur-lined handcuffs. In announcing the sweep, Judd criticized Craigslist for "facilitating prostitution" and deriving proceeds from the illegal act, since the site charges for the placement of the adult ads. Judd added that he wanted to press charges against the web site, which has previously pledged to law enforcement agencies that it would crack down on ads promoting prostitution.
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InkChic78
2009-09-15, 02:12 PM
that black girl with a funky eye looks like she could (would) cutabitch. :ohnoes:
(6th one from the bottom, on the left - since there are two funky eyed women)
ChicoMDK
2009-09-15, 02:15 PM
OMG MOM !!!
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-15, 02:23 PM
Nat is probably already contacting them
bboyneko
2009-09-15, 02:27 PM
wow alot of the ones at the top are way cute. Id hit it for 150 roses an hour.
I love how a few of them are smiling like these are their publicity photos for America's Got Talent.
wow alot of the ones at the top are way cute. Id hit it for 150 roses an hour.
A "lot"??
LOL.
Which ones, Dan?
bboyneko
2009-09-15, 02:34 PM
A "lot"??
LOL.
Which ones, Dan?
Actually sorry, I guess I meant to say way more than I expected were actually decent:
Row 1 -Both
Row 2 - Both
Row 3 - 1st
Row 6 - 1st
the rest I don't care for
GiveMeFunkyBeats
2009-09-15, 02:41 PM
hahahahahah
ewe dan.
konversion
2009-09-15, 02:42 PM
i'd bang the first one.
I can't get over #17's "dead fish" eye.
I bet she does (did) some freaky shit with that eye.
MINDPHUQ
2009-09-15, 02:43 PM
i'd bang the first one.
she's probably one of the pregnant ones.
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 02:44 PM
http://v.tbo.com/MemberGallery.aspx?nickName=lsullivan
^ link to full gallery of each person arrested, as well as their name and what they were charged with when you click each image.... some of the girls were actually pimps...
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 02:46 PM
i'd bang the first one.
Lindsay Buddenbaum of Orlando... her address and phone number are available on zabasearch ;) you should call her, I bet she needs help with legal fees now....
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-15, 02:46 PM
wow alot of the ones at the top are way cute. Id hit it for 150 roses an hour.
Apparently here for $30 they spend the whole night, and clean your place in the morning.
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 02:51 PM
i bought a chinese hooker once.... she sucked my laundry clean for $5
in b4 that's racist....
Shakey
2009-09-15, 02:57 PM
http://v.tbo.com/MemberGallery.aspx?nickName=lsullivan
^ link to full gallery of each person arrested, as well as their name and what they were charged with when you click each image.... some of the girls were actually mistresses.
fixt
just fyi: female pimps aren't pimps.
konversion
2009-09-15, 02:57 PM
Lindsay Buddenbaum of Orlando... her address and phone number are available on zabasearch ;) you should call her, I bet she needs help with legal fees now....
hahah, word... if she's one of the preggers ones, she'll need a baby dady =x
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 03:00 PM
fixt
just fyi: female pimps aren't pimps.
<img src="http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedImages/Stories/County_Stories/lgophotdate.jpg">
just fyi: according to the police image board of the arrests they, indeed, ARE pimps.
Rican
2009-09-15, 03:06 PM
LOL what's with the fire font... do cops sit around finding cool fonts for their operation image boards? or do they source that out? haha
Shakey
2009-09-15, 03:07 PM
llol, ok. well according to common knowledge, they are mistresses.
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 03:09 PM
llol, ok. well according to common knowledge, they are mistresses.
no, according to common knowledge, they are MADAMS
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-15, 03:11 PM
Exactly. Mistresses are classy ho's
Madams, provide mistresses,
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-15, 03:11 PM
llol, ok. well according to common knowledge, they are mistresses.
Ladies is pimps too, go on brush ya shoulders off.
[r]evolution
2009-09-15, 03:38 PM
Apparently here for $30 they spend the whole night, and clean your place in the morning.
Hmm.
Cheaper than a wife... and more benefits.
zarbizarre
2009-09-15, 03:57 PM
Exactly. Mistresses are classy ho's
Madams, provide mistresses,
Mistresses are also another term for professional dominatrices...
and in that note...
FLUĢĢÅƏŅKЀČÍŒβỢLSÉN
PaulieWalnuts
2009-09-16, 03:16 PM
that black girl with a funky eye looks like she could (would) cutabitch. :ohnoes:
(6th one from the bottom, on the left - since there are two funky eyed women)
The one next to her, on the right... you ever see Coming To America, the scene where Prince Hakim and Semi are at the club speed-dating and that one chick is like "I was Joan of Arc in my former life" and lights a Bic right under her hand and just holds it there?
Yeah, that's her.
Hitoi
2009-09-16, 03:27 PM
LOL what's with the fire font... do cops sit around finding cool fonts for their operation image boards?
:haha:
MURAMASA
2009-09-16, 03:39 PM
#1 I'd smash, the rest can get on the bus to Nat's house.
...Is it me, or does this feel like the beginning of an X-rated Schindler's List?
THE BLACKEST
2009-09-16, 03:52 PM
The one next to her, on the right... you ever see Coming To America, the scene where Prince Hakim and Semi are at the club speed-dating and that one chick is like "I was Joan of Arc in my former life" and lights a Bic right under her hand and just holds it there?
Yeah, that's her.
The one that worshipped the devil was hot.
Hitoi
2009-09-16, 03:57 PM
The one that worshipped the devil was hot.
I remember that one. She kinda looked like Jackeé.
PaulieWalnuts
2009-09-16, 04:04 PM
The one that puts Hakim and Semi to sleep is the one that I want to donkey punch.
Seriously, we need to legalize prostitution. All those girls have to go right back to dating just to afford their lawyers, and then they get three strikes and get stuck with a felony for something that didn't hurt anybody (unless clients were into that).
The only people who benefit are lawyers and for-profit prison companies, and these are the first groups rational people acknowledge we need to kill off!
Anti-prostitution laws are white "gentlemens'" ways of saying: we're afraid of our own sexualities so let's outlaw everybody else's.
An athlete in New Zealand is funding his trip to the Olympics with funds from his house of prostitution, for Christ's sake. WTF do Americans have to be such losers?
THE BLACKEST
2009-09-16, 04:23 PM
Man if prostitution becomes legal, best believe I'm gunna be pimpin Manassas. Then pimpin will be easy.
dionysiac
2009-09-16, 04:23 PM
The one that puts Hakim and Semi to sleep is the one that I want to donkey punch.
Seriously, we need to legalize prostitution. All those girls have to go right back to dating just to afford their lawyers, and then they get three strikes and get stuck with a felony for something that didn't hurt anybody (unless clients were into that).
The only people who benefit are lawyers and for-profit prison companies, and these are the first groups rational people acknowledge we need to kill off!
Anti-prostitution laws are white "gentlemens'" ways of saying: we're afraid of our own sexualities so let's outlaw everybody else's.
An athlete in New Zealand is funding his trip to the Olympics with funds from his house of prostitution, for Christ's sake. WTF do Americans have to be such losers?
I've been looking recently for good ideas on how to convince your average joe that the prison/justice system needs an overhaul.
Non violent people should be kept out of prison but most people with no personal connection have the attitude of 'if they weren't bad they wouldn't be in jail' or 'why care about criminals, they don't deserve any empathy'.
Catalyst
2009-09-16, 05:34 PM
Apparently here for $30 they spend the whole night, and clean your place in the morning.
"how much is it if you just clean? can I substitute the diseasing sex you offer with you making breakfast?"
Shakey
2009-09-17, 05:41 PM
"how much is it if you just clean? can I substitute the diseasing sex you offer with you making breakfast?"
I lived with a buddy of mine in Indianapolis for a very short while and we had parties almost every night. The place was just filthy after a while. We were trying to hire a hooker to come over, get naked, and clean house , for the same hourly fee as sexual favors. Every single one we tried denied us. Finally, after about 10 phone calls, my friend got frustrated and yelled into the phone "YOU LAZY HOES WANNA COME AND SUCK DICKS ALL NIGHT BUT YOU WON'T SPEND A FEW HOURS CLEANING?"
I guess it was sort of a "you had to be there moment", but it was funny at the time.
badkitty3804
2009-09-17, 07:49 PM
Wonderful.
The police have time to do things like target consenting adults, but my sexual assault case is continually placed on the back burner and I'm left to continuously call to see if they've had the time to bother with the stack of information that I've taken the time to organize and simplify their work with.
empath
2009-09-17, 08:04 PM
let's play 'spot the meth addict'
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-17, 10:24 PM
Wonderful.
The police have time to do things like target consenting adults, but my sexual assault case is continually placed on the back burner and I'm left to continuously call to see if they've had the time to bother with the stack of information that I've taken the time to organize and simplify their work with.
I think if you want police results, you're going to have to do something drastic, like hire a hardass attorney or picket the police station. Unfortunately, I don't think calling sporadically or even regularly is going to do jack shit.
PaulieWalnuts
2009-09-17, 11:04 PM
let's play 'spot the meth addict'
Fifth from the bottom, girl on the right! She looks too put-together to be a streetwalker like the other girls seem to be readily capable of, so my guess is she's supporting a drug habit.
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-18, 02:27 AM
The one that puts Hakim and Semi to sleep is the one that I want to donkey punch.
Seriously, we need to legalize prostitution. All those girls have to go right back to dating just to afford their lawyers, and then they get three strikes and get stuck with a felony for something that didn't hurt anybody (unless clients were into that).
The only people who benefit are lawyers and for-profit prison companies, and these are the first groups rational people acknowledge we need to kill off!
Anti-prostitution laws are white "gentlemens'" ways of saying: we're afraid of our own sexualities so let's outlaw everybody else's.
An athlete in New Zealand is funding his trip to the Olympics with funds from his house of prostitution, for Christ's sake. WTF do Americans have to be such losers?
If you really think prostitution hurts no one, I suggest you pick up a book called "Hello, my name Lon". It's written by a woman here who started working in Pattaya at 14. I've skimmed through it, it talks about the conditions here that make so many women turn to prostitution, about her personal experience and how that lifestyle made her feel, and so on. I've also talked to a lot of the girls that work here (since the farang bars are FULL of them), and most of them, while they enjoy what they do some of the time, have some horror stories to tell. I've been told that some of them won't go home with Indian or Arabic guys, because of the completely gross things those guys make them do.
It's really fucking gross seeing all the 70 and 80 year old farang walking around here with 19 and 20 year old Thai girls. 2 nights ago I was out with some friends, and a girl that had been sort of dancing with this fat gross old guy started dancing with me. She said she wanted to leave with me, and I said I wasn't interested in paying her. She was practically begging me to pay her to leave with me so she didn't have to leave with that guy. But, because of the setup here, she has to pay the bar 500 Baht to leave with a guy, so if she'd left with me for free she would have been paying for it. (I just left and went to another bar, met a girl later that wasn't a hooker)
Just up the soi from my hotel there are 2 straight blocks of nothing but girly bars (and that's just one spot of many in the Sukhumvit area). The girls all sit along the sidewalk and literally grab guys to try to get them to stop there and go home with them. I was walking by last night to go out and heard a girl practically shouting to this one guy, "You fuck me, you fuck me hard. You fuck me hard." Meanwhile, there were 2 girls that must have been 6 years old, 5 feet away, begging for change. I'm willing to bet those 6 year olds will grow up to work in one of those girly bars. And there's a school right across the street from my hotel.
Is that the kind of thing you want in your neighborhood?
badkitty3804
2009-09-18, 09:59 AM
Is arresting them, humiliating them and posting their faces all over the internet going to get them out of the lifestyle? No. It's going to solidify the fact that they can't find legit work and have to stay in the line of work. You think someone is going to hire someone on when they're all over the internet and labeled a pariah?
And why are the women so targeted by police when in many cases they fall into the profession out of necessity, yet have special programs for the men that are arrested for soliciting so that they can avoid arrest and "break their habit". Yet they go for the jugular with the women. How is that not a fucked up dynamic? The men that are buying the services and making it possible for the women to work are just "poor men that wanted companionship", but the women are whores.
If you really have a problem with the industry because of what the girls are put through, why not support programs and groups like HIPS that support the girls with their safety and well being. Or why not support transitional programs that help the girls find their way out of it? Or the groups that really grab into the underage trade side of it?
The legal system is fucked in it's methods. And adult, consenting women that enter into the industry should be able to do what they wish with their bodies. I can understand people having an issue with street-side soliciting, but when it's not even remotely affecting your life, butt out.
dionysiac
2009-09-18, 10:48 AM
And why are the women so targeted by police when in many cases they fall into the profession out of necessity, yet have special programs for the men that are arrested for soliciting so that they can avoid arrest and "break their habit". Yet they go for the jugular with the women. How is that not a fucked up dynamic? The men that are buying the services and making it possible for the women to work are just "poor men that wanted companionship", but the women are whores.
Um. I think it's easy to see the dif between the person running an illegal business vs a person patronizing that biz. You can see it everywhere in our legal code, like punishing drug dealers with harsher sentences than the guy buying a dime bag.
MURAMASA
2009-09-18, 10:49 AM
Um. I think it's easy to see the dif between the person running an illegal business vs a person patronizing that biz. You can see it everywhere in our legal code, like punishing drug dealers with harsher sentences than the guy buying a dime bag.
"men that are arrested for soliciting"
She's talking about male prostitutes (Like Miguel).
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-18, 11:03 AM
oh hai
dionysiac
2009-09-18, 11:23 AM
"men that are arrested for soliciting"
She's talking about male prostitutes (Like Miguel).
So there are actual diversion programs that are gender specific? Men have options that women don't?
bboyneko
2009-09-18, 11:46 AM
I was walking by last night to go out and heard a girl practically shouting to this one guy, "You fuck me, you fuck me hard. You fuck me hard."
Is that the kind of thing you want in your neighborhood?
hell yes
PaulieWalnuts
2009-09-18, 02:09 PM
Pattaya is not the rest of Thailand. It's a city. There's red light districts but there's nice places, too. The red light districts seem unseemly but they are also the areas where costs of living are cheaper, so it's possible for a perfectly moral citizen from the countryside to get a good value on an apartment living above a titty bar. It's like living next door to a factory; you put up with the noise and lights for the advantage of good road access and cheap rent.
In any event, prostitution in America doesn't have to be all out in the street like in Thailand. In New Zealand, where prostitution is legal, no streetwalking is allowed and all solicitations are conducted indoors. The law lets hookers work and live together. They can network without fear of anything bad happening for knowing each other's names and locations and things. As a result of this, there's a lot less abuse of prostitutes in the country, and their average health is better.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-18, 02:17 PM
Is arresting them, humiliating them and posting their faces all over the internet going to get them out of the lifestyle? No. It's going to solidify the fact that they can't find legit work and have to stay in the line of work. You think someone is going to hire someone on when they're all over the internet and labeled a pariah?
If you really have a problem with the industry because of what the girls are put through, why not support programs and groups like HIPS that support the girls with their safety and well being. Or why not support transitional programs that help the girls find their way out of it? Or the groups that really grab into the underage trade side of it?
Emily, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but you're really all over the map when it comes to this issue.
In some of your posts prostitution is "empowering" and should be legalized because consenting adults should be allowed to do whatever they want.
In other posts, you come across as sounding like prostitution turns women into victims and that it's so traumatizing that they need rehabilitation and counseling to overcome it.
Which is it? It can't be both empowering AND victimizing, you know? I could understand both arguments in tandem if we were talking about women sold into illegal prostitution, but the women that are the subject of this thread actively chose to pursue this line of work of their own free will. Are they people who are in need of help or are they woman who should have the choice to sell their bodies?
I know I've responded more than a few times to your posts these past couple of days, but it's only because you and I happen to be passionate about the same topics and I feel compelled to respond to them. I would respond this way to anyone, don't want you to think I'm picking on your or singling you out or anything. <3
sassypance
2009-09-18, 02:48 PM
WTF. Is it some sort of requirement to have terrible eyebrows in order to be a Craigslist hooker? :chilly:
bboyneko
2009-09-18, 03:03 PM
*ahem* and now a haiku
An ad on craigslist
For a woman of the night
She has a penis
PaulieWalnuts
2009-09-18, 04:10 PM
You must spread some Reputation around like gonorrhea before giving it to bboyneko again.
THE BLACKEST
2009-09-18, 04:52 PM
*ahem* and now a haiku
An ad on craigslist
For a woman of the night
She has a penis
Wow. :star:
badkitty3804
2009-09-19, 08:12 AM
Emily, I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but you're really all over the map when it comes to this issue.
In some of your posts prostitution is "empowering" and should be legalized because consenting adults should be allowed to do whatever they want.
In other posts, you come across as sounding like prostitution turns women into victims and that it's so traumatizing that they need rehabilitation and counseling to overcome it.
Which is it? It can't be both empowering AND victimizing, you know? I could understand both arguments in tandem if we were talking about women sold into illegal prostitution, but the women that are the subject of this thread actively chose to pursue this line of work of their own free will. Are they people who are in need of help or are they woman who should have the choice to sell their bodies?
I know I've responded more than a few times to your posts these past couple of days, but it's only because you and I happen to be passionate about the same topics and I feel compelled to respond to them. I would respond this way to anyone, don't want you to think I'm picking on your or singling you out or anything. <3
I'm not all over the place. If a woman is okay with the work and is doing it for reasons to improve her life and is not emotionally ruined by it, and maintains the power dynamic as the provider...it's empowering. If a woman does it because it's her only choice, because she has problems that it's perpetuating. or because of an abusive situation (forced to do so, forced to stay, or regularly abused by clientele), it's victimizing. And sometimes those that start for the right reasons end up staying for the wrong reasons, addiction to the lifestyle, and need help getting out.
Why can't it be both? Not everyone has the same experience in it - reasons for starting, reasons for quitting, types of clientele, etc etc. Some women need support, some dont. It's not black and white.
Fact of the matter is, they're adults and do not need a nanny state saying that their personal choice is void because of a long standing moral issue with it.
buzzboy
2009-09-19, 01:59 PM
they are whores. if a man does it he's a whore too. empowerment? no, whorishness.
5l1mm
2009-09-19, 03:57 PM
im for the legalization, and unionization of prostitution.
it can be harmful, but most risks include disease spread witch can be regulated much like the food industry.
plus entertainment tax is buku bucks.
times are tough let people make $
who knows this could be the perfect "stimulus" plan.
oh yes..
i went there....
buzzboy
2009-09-19, 04:12 PM
what i don't get about the laws;
If a guy and a girl meet on teh street and decide to go back to a room and get busy for free its ok. But if the saem scenario happens and one of them gets paid...its illegal.
If you think about it, its not much differnt then takin a girl out to dinner and a movie then bangin her and never calling back. I mean its the same thing, except in the latter scenario the man decides what the money is spent on.
Is it illegal because it's not likely they will claim that as income on taxes?
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-20, 10:17 AM
Pattaya is not the rest of Thailand. It's a city. There's red light districts but there's nice places, too. The red light districts seem unseemly but they are also the areas where costs of living are cheaper, so it's possible for a perfectly moral citizen from the countryside to get a good value on an apartment living above a titty bar. It's like living next door to a factory; you put up with the noise and lights for the advantage of good road access and cheap rent.
In any event, prostitution in America doesn't have to be all out in the street like in Thailand. In New Zealand, where prostitution is legal, no streetwalking is allowed and all solicitations are conducted indoors. The law lets hookers work and live together. They can network without fear of anything bad happening for knowing each other's names and locations and things. As a result of this, there's a lot less abuse of prostitutes in the country, and their average health is better.
I was talking about Bangkok, the only place I've been to in Pattaya is the mansion.
There IS no "red light district" here, the prostitution is everywhere. It does tend to center more on places near farang hotels, but there are girly bars all over BKK. They're all over Chiang Mai as well.
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-20, 10:22 AM
what i don't get about the laws;
If a guy and a girl meet on teh street and decide to go back to a room and get busy for free its ok. But if the saem scenario happens and one of them gets paid...its illegal.
If you think about it, its not much differnt then takin a girl out to dinner and a movie then bangin her and never calling back. I mean its the same thing, except in the latter scenario the man decides what the money is spent on.
Is it illegal because it's not likely they will claim that as income on taxes?
The difference is in one scenario there's no solicitation. And getting hassled constantly by hookers sucks.
You don't have row upon row of girl grabbing your arm and refusing to let go, creating a scene in the street, and so on, to get guys to take them to dinner and a movie.
The issue, to me, is not that money is changing hands for sex. It's all the other things that come through that door once you open it.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 10:10 PM
I'm not all over the place. If a woman is okay with the work and is doing it for reasons to improve her life and is not emotionally ruined by it, and maintains the power dynamic as the provider...it's empowering. If a woman does it because it's her only choice, because she has problems that it's perpetuating. or because of an abusive situation (forced to do so, forced to stay, or regularly abused by clientele), it's victimizing. And sometimes those that start for the right reasons end up staying for the wrong reasons, addiction to the lifestyle, and need help getting out.
Why can't it be both? Not everyone has the same experience in it - reasons for starting, reasons for quitting, types of clientele, etc etc. Some women need support, some dont. It's not black and white.
Fact of the matter is, they're adults and do not need a nanny state saying that their personal choice is void because of a long standing moral issue with it.
The fatal flaw in the empowerment argument is that you can only use your sexuality to prop up your self-esteem for so long. If prostitution was so empowering, every woman would do, they would give seminars on it. There's a reason it's usually only the poor, desperate and destitute who pursue that line of work.
I dunno Emily, if there was poison being sold in a product and one person died and/or was injured from it, wouldn't you pull it from the shelf? I can promise you, prostitution is far more damaging to a woman's self-esteem then most people probably realize. I feel part of our government's job is to protect us, and outlawing prostitution, I believe, helps do that.
I'll tell you one thing, no one's life is being irrevocably harmed by the illegalization of prostitution, so I think the pros against the legalization of prostitution far outweigh the cons.
zarbizarre
2009-09-21, 10:15 PM
Man if prostitution becomes legal, best believe I'm gunna be pimpin Manassas. Then pimpin will be easy.
when you say that out loud, it isnt as funny as - and a lot more gay than - you thought... "pimping man asses" .... or maybe it is funnier now?
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 10:21 PM
im for the legalization, and unionization of prostitution.
it can be harmful, but most risks include disease spread witch can be regulated much like the food industry.
plus entertainment tax is buku bucks.
times are tough let people make $
who knows this could be the perfect "stimulus" plan.
oh yes..
i went there....
Bad analogy. The FDA lets ANYTHING pass for "food" nowadays.
zarbizarre
2009-09-21, 10:24 PM
I'll tell you one thing, no one's life is being irrevocably harmed by the illegalization of prostitution
WRONG... i.e. end up getting arrested and convicted - they are now irrevocably harmed by prostitution being illegal by having a permanent criminal record.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 10:32 PM
WRONG... i.e. end up getting arrested and convicted - they are now irrevocably harmed by prostitution being illegal by having a permanent criminal record.
No. Now they can receive therapy and services and rescue from a life most didn't want to begin with. Getting busted, for a lot of people, is the best thing that ever happened to them, and I'm getting that from the horses' mouthes.
If you love what you do, and you're good at it, you can do it under the table forever. How many of you know at least one person who's sold pot for the past 20 years? It's like that. If you're not into prostitution for drugs and not because you're desperate, you don't make stupid decisions that lead you to get caught OR you go where it is legal, like parts of Nevada or Amsterdam.
zarbizarre
2009-09-21, 10:36 PM
No. Now they can receive therapy and services and rescue from a life most didn't want to begin with. Getting busted, for a lot of people, is the best thing that ever happened to them, and I'm getting that from the horses' mouthes.
If you love what you do, and you're good at it, you can do it under the table forever. How many of you know at least one person who's sold pot for the past 20 years? It's like that. If you're not into prostitution for drugs and not because you're desperate, you don't make stupid decisions that lead you to get caught OR you go where it is legal, like parts of Nevada or Amsterdam.
Well, the prostitutes I know trump the ones you know, lol. Google Dolores French and Annie Sprinkle... good friends of my dad (RIP)... I'll take their word about it over yours any day of the week....
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-21, 10:37 PM
anecdotal eviwhat?
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 10:43 PM
Well, the prostitutes I know trump the ones you know, lol. Google Dolores French and Annie Sprinkle... good friends of my dad (RIP)... I'll take their word about it over yours any day of the week....
I wasn't talking about just prostitutes, I was talking about criminals in general.
And Alan, WHY would you post something that bolstered MY argument? It seems illegalization of prostitution hasn't hurt Annie's or Dolores business or popularity at all, which just furthers MY claim that if a person is good at something, they normally don't get caught. In fact, they're doing EVEN BETTER than not getting caught by finding legal loopholes where they can outright create websites about it. It's just proof that prostitution doesn't have to legalized to be successful or lucrative.
Well, anyway, thanks for taking my argument from the abstract to the concrete.
zarbizarre
2009-09-21, 10:45 PM
I wasn't talking about just prostitutes, I was talking about criminals in general.
And Alan, WHY would you post something that bolstered MY argument? It seems illegalization of prostitution hasn't hurt Annie's or Dolores business or popularity at all, which just furthers MY claim that if a person is good at something, they normally don't get caught. In fact, they're doing EVEN BETTER than not getting caught by finding legal loopholes where they can outright create websites about it. It's just proof that prostitution doesn't have to legalized to be successful or lucrative. Well, anyway, thanks for taking my argument from the abstract to the concrete.
lol, it would bolster your argument, if indeed they were never busted for it.... but alas, that is not the case.
FAIL.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 10:49 PM
lol, it would bolster your argument, if indeed they were never busted for it.... but alas, that is not the case.
FAIL.
no, no, it makes my argument BETTER. They were even busted for it, it's still illegal and they're STILL getting away with it. See? Totally doesn't have to be legalized to be successful. A person can be a repeat offender and STILL get away with it.
How many crack dealers do you know that can feature their crack on a website? or that would even think about being completely public about it after being busted for it?
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-21, 11:23 PM
no, no, it makes my argument BETTER. They were even busted for it, it's still illegal and they're STILL getting away with it. See? Totally doesn't have to be legalized to be successful. A person can be a repeat offender and STILL get away with it.
How many crack dealers do you know that can feature their crack on a website? or that would even think about being completely public about it after being busted for it?
Marion Barry?
zarbizarre
2009-09-21, 11:24 PM
no, no, it makes my argument BETTER. They were even busted for it, it's still illegal and they're STILL getting away with it. See? Totally doesn't have to be legalized to be successful. A person can be a repeat offender and STILL get away with it.
No it doesnt, it makes it so they HAD to figure out ways to get away with it because they were irrevocably harmed by the illegalization of prostitution with the criminal records, and unable to procure legit work. Thus, invalidating everything you are attempting to say. Again, FAIL. :)
How many crack dealers do you know that can feature their crack on a website?
twelve.
or that would even think about being completely public about it after being busted for it?
All of them. Once they are busted, it becomes a matter of public record, nothing more public than public records, lol.
FAIL :)
<img src="http://rix0r.nl/imagemacros/pwned_slap%5B1%5D.jpg">
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 11:52 PM
No it doesnt, it makes it so they HAD to figure out ways to get away with it because they were irrevocably harmed by the illegalization of prostitution with the criminal records, and unable to procure legit work. Thus, invalidating everything you are attempting to say. Again, FAIL. :)
no it doesn't. I said that women could be successful as prostitutes without it being legal. and they are. the end.
All of them. Once they are busted, it becomes a matter of public record, nothing more public than public records, lol.
Nope. First of all, not all busts go on public record. Secondly, there's a difference between something being on public record and you, yourself, advertising you're [STILL] a crack dealer and putting it on a website.
Imma start calling you too short. Because you're arguments always fall too short of being logical.
You are your own worst enemy, you know. You pose that having a record for being a prostitute "ZOMG ruins your life!" and then you turn around and post some of the most successful prostitutes I've ever seen. That advertise. ONLINE. It's been a long time since I've seen someone sandbag himself that hard.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-21, 11:57 PM
Marion Barry?
Well, I don't know if he advertised himself as being a crackhead during the election after he had been arrested, but yes, there is at least one known crackhead where people KNEW he was a crackhead and it didn't ruin his political career. Politicians either get completely blackballed or get off scott free. It seems there's often no middle ground. Is it that people can't let go of their heros? or are they just compassionate and give someone they knew another chance? I dunno.
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 12:22 AM
Nope. First of all, not all busts go on public record.
False. Unless the person is a minor, all criminal busts are openly available in public records, including the disposition of the case (guilty, not guilty nolle prosequi, PBJ, etc). Even traffic court cases end up in public records.
Secondly, there's a difference between something being on public record and you, yourself, advertising you're [STILL] a crack dealer and putting it on a website.
bad analogy in the first place. crack dealing carries a much heftier jail sentence and mandatory minimums than prostitution... FAIL.
Imma start calling you too short. Because you're arguments always fall too short of being logical.
You are your own worst enemy, you know. You pose that having a record for being a prostitute "ZOMG ruins your life!" and then you turn around and post some of the most successful prostitutes I've ever seen. That advertise. ONLINE. It's been a long time since I've seen someone sandbag himself that hard.
The websites they have, arent selling their sexual services, they are selling their stories - books, artwork, etc. based on their lives as sex workers. Neither Dolores or Annie are active in the business except for lecturing, etc. See, I already knew this fact, being I know them, but you, in your haste to try to show me "failing" didnt take the time to do your proper research, so I just let you keep going with it so you could dig yourself deeper....
The fatal flaw in the empowerment argument is that you can only use your sexuality to prop up your self-esteem for so long. If prostitution was so empowering, every woman would do, they would give seminars on it.
^^ That is exactly what they are doing, and this is the entire point I have been making here. They ARE giving seminars on it, they are writing books on it, they are appearing on Oprah about it, etc.
So again, you FAIL, not only at what you were trying to say to Emily, but you also FAIL at telling me I am failing when I ALLOWED you to keep posting to further my point before fully owning you like your name is Toby and I am your massa (in b4 that's racist). I wanted you to keep typing about this to get right back here to this point.
Your other point was that no one is harmed by it being illegal, which is untrue. They were harmed by it, and they had to stick with sex work, because of it being illegal. It was their hard work and determination amidst the harm that made them such successes.
Thank you for playing.
You = Loss of Epic Proportions. Me = Win.
Now go ahead and clock me another win by trying to tell me that I somehow proved YOUR point again.
bwahahahahahahaha
IonaGlasscock, whatevs
2009-09-22, 12:30 AM
Subscribed.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 12:31 AM
False. Unless the person is a minor, all criminal busts are openly available in public records, including the disposition of the case (guilty, not guilty nolle prosequi, PBJ, etc). Even traffic court cases end up in public records.
Nope.
The websites they have, arent selling their sexual services, they are selling their stories - books, artwork, etc. based on their lives as sex workers. Neither Dolores or Annie are active in the business except for lecturing, etc.
suuuuuuuurrrrrrreeeee. *wink* *wink*
That is exactly what they are doing, and this is the entire point I have been making here. They ARE giving seminars on it, they are writing books on it, they are appearing on Oprah about it, etc.
Selling theories about sex, how to be sexual, how to free your sexual self is NOT the same as directly selling your body. In the first instance you're selling your IDEAS, in the second one, you're putting a price tag on your body alone. BIG DIFFERENCE.
Your other point was that no one is harmed by it being illegal, which is untrue. They were harmed by it, and they had to stick with sex work, because of it being illegal. It was their hard work and determination amidst the harm that made them such successes.
Dude, reading is fundamental. What I said was that no one has been IRREVOCABLY harmed, i.e., done irreversible damage to their entire lives by being denied the right to be a prostitute. The ladies that you've mentioned WERE NOT *IRREVOCABLY* harmed. Because they were smart, they turned it into a business.
I almost hate to say it, but you proved my point again. I swear. You have a knack, if it wasn't so facepalmy, it would almost be impressive.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 12:38 AM
http://www.anniesprinkle.org/html/writings/brushes_crushes.html
From Annie Sprinkle's website:
I continued to do prostitution for twenty years. Often there were busts and arrests, but lucky for me they always came down on my days off.
Lucky? for 20 years? maybe. I don't know about the rest of you, but I call that skillful, not lucky.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 12:41 AM
what i don't get about the laws;
If a guy and a girl meet on teh street and decide to go back to a room and get busy for free its ok. But if the saem scenario happens and one of them gets paid...its illegal.
If you think about it, its not much differnt then takin a girl out to dinner and a movie then bangin her and never calling back. I mean its the same thing, except in the latter scenario the man decides what the money is spent on.
Is it illegal because it's not likely they will claim that as income on taxes?
What *I* don't get is if you pay one person for sex it's prostitution, but if you pay them both and put them in front of a camera, it's porn and legal.
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 12:44 AM
Nope.
Yup.
suuuuuuuurrrrrrreeeee. *wink* *wink*
prove me wrong.
Selling theories about sex, how to be sexual, how to free your sexual self is NOT the same as directly selling your body. In the first instance you're selling your IDEAS, in the second one, you're putting a price tag on your body alone. BIG DIFFERENCE.
wtf r u going on about? lol trying to talk in circles about stuff you dont have any idea about haha. you stated that if it were so empowering, women would be holding seminars on it, which in fact they are.
Dude, reading is fundamental.
and apparently u are really bad at it, lol.
What I said was that no one has been IRREVOCABLY harmed, i.e., done irreversible damage to their entire lives by being denied the right to be a prostitute. The ladies that you've mentioned WERE NOT *IRREVOCABLY* harmed. Because they were smart, they turned it into a business.
sure they were irrevocably harmed - they couldnt go back into legitimate work and had to continue being prostitutes and criminals.
In your own words:
I can promise you, prostitution is far more damaging to a woman's self-esteem then most people probably realize. I feel part of our government's job is to protect us, and outlawing prostitution, I believe, helps do that.
Them having to stay prostitutes, according to you, was soooo damaging to their self esteem...
And that point, of course, I proved otherwise, by showing you people who are the exact opposite of what you were saying, to which you tried to respin into you being right hahaha
I almost hate to say it, but you proved my point again. I swear. You have a knack, if it wasn't so facepalmy, it would almost be impressive.
you only hate to say it because I TOLD YOU YOU WERE GOING TO SAY IT AGAIN, and thus clock me another WIN
why dont you say it one more time for me, so I can clock another win again??? :D
You argue like a republican politician on FoxNews --- trying to respin everything that makes you look like an idiot into something else. You're the Sarah Palin of the buzzboard, only slightly smarter because you have a bigger vocabulary and every other word out of your mouth isn't "maverick"
lol.
here, you need this, cuz I just shitted all over you lol:
<img src="http://blogs.creativeloafing.com/dailyloaf/files/2009/08/toilet-paper1.jpg">
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 12:55 AM
prove me wrong.
Prove ME wrong.
wtf r u going on about? lol trying to talk in circles about stuff you dont have any idea about haha. you stated that if it were so empowering, women would be holding seminars on it, which in fact they are.
are you seriously this retarded? they are not teaching them how to be hookers, they are teaching them how to be better lovers in their day-to-day life. I know you're a swinger and all, so for you maybe there's no difference, but for the majority of us who practice monogamy, there's a HUGE difference.
sure they were irrevocably harmed - they couldnt go back into legitimate work and had to continue being prostitutes and criminals.
what do you mean they "couldn't go back into legitimate work"? they NEVER wanted to have a "normal" job. how do you know they couldn't go back into normal work when THEY NEVER TRIED TO GO BACK INTO NORMAL WORK? their busts didn't harm them at all from pursuing the career THEY ALWAYS WANTED. did you bother to read their bios at all?
Them having to stay prostitutes, according to you, was soooo damaging to their self esteem...
Look, I'm tired of having this same argument with you.
I never, ever said all women feel just one way.
I said MOST women don't want to be hookers, it damages their self-esteem.
I also said that the women who TRULY enjoy it, find a way to do it without getting busted.
Case in point: Annie Sprinkle was a prostitute for 20 years and never got caught.
And if I'm the Sarah Palin, you are definitely the George W. Bush, blindly following logic only you understand leaving the rest of us scratching our heads saying, "WTF is he talking about?"
Please prove my point by posting another picture that most 6 year olds would find funny.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 01:10 AM
ZOMG, classes for hookers. :delirious:
I can see it now:
How to Choose Your Pimp 101 (complete with a lab on how to avoid the pesky pimp slap)
Location, Location, Location: Choosing a corner that works for you
Thigh-Highs or Knee-Highs?: How to dress appropriately for your john
Wash it, Honey!: How to launder your illegal money
OMFG, what is THAT?: How to identify most bumps and avoid STDs
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 01:32 AM
Prove ME wrong.
I already have. Show me on their sites where they are actively soliciting johns.
are you seriously this retarded? they are not teaching them how to be hookers, they are teaching them how to be better lovers in their day-to-day life. I know you're a swinger and all, so for you maybe there's no difference, but for the majority of us who practice monogamy, there's a HUGE difference.
I think you are confusing them with Jenna Jameson. jenna = how to make love like a porn star. Dolores = my life as a prostitute, pamphlets on how to not get busted, how to protect yourself, seminars on how to protect yourself, advocate of prostitute rights... etc YOU are the retarded one, lol.
An example, one of Annie's writings and teachings:
40 REASONS WHY WHORES ARE MY HEROES
Whores have the ability to share their most private and sensitive body parts with total strangers.
Whores have good senses of humor.
Whores challenge sexual mores.
Whores are playful.
Whores are tough.
Whores have careers based on giving pleasure.
Whores are creative.
Whores are adventurous and dare to live dangerously.
Whores teach people how to be better lovers.
Whores are multi-cultured and multi-gendered.
Whores give excellent advice and help people with their personal problems.
Whores have fun.
Whores wear exciting clothes.
Whores have patience and tolerance for people that other people could never manage to put up with.
Whores make lonely people less lonely.
Whores are independent.
Whores teach people how to have safer sex.
Whores are a tradition.
Whores are hot and hip.
Whores are free spirits.
Whores relieve millions of people of unwanted stress and tension.
Whores heal.
Whores endure in the face of fierce prejudice.
Whores make good money.
Whores always have a job.
Whores are sexy and erotic.
Whores have special talents other people just don't have. Not everyone has what it takes to be a whore.
Whores are interesting people with lots of exciting life stories.
Whores get laid a lot.
Whores help people explore their sexual desires.
Whores explore their own sexual desires.
Whores are not afraid of sex.
Whores hustle.
Whores sparkle.
Whores are entertaining.
Whores have the guts to wear very big wigs.
Whores are not ashamed to be naked.
Whores help the handicapped.
Whores make their own hours.
Whores are rebelling against the absurd, patriarchal, sex-negative laws against their profession and are fighting for the legal right to receive financial compensation for their valuable work.
DO YOU HAVE WHAT IT TAKES TO BE A WHORE?
And another:
HOW TO CURE SEX WORKER BURNOUT
STEP 1 - Admit you are burnt out. This sounds easy, but it’s the hardest step. Our egos, as well as our incomes, are invested in feeling good about our work. It’s not easy to admit that you are a mess. See it as an opportunity to grow.
STEP 2 - Take breaks and vacations from your work as a matter of course. Get sun, fresh air, take a boat ride. Spend time in nature. You may never even get crispy.
STEP 3 - Spend time alone. Do something relaxing and meditative. A languorous candle lit herbal bath can do wonders.
STEP 4 - Get in touch with your feelings and express them. Repressed emotions alone can create burn out.
STEP 5 - Get professional therapy. It really can put things in perspective, and help you be more conscious about your personal challanges. Use only a non-judgmental, sex positive therapist. Be honest with yourself.
STEP 6 - Start a support group with other sex workers. The BEST cure of all is to share your experiences with your peers who have had similar experiences. It’s very empowering!
STEP 7 - Take good care of your body. Eat well, exercise, and get bodywork. A good massage can do wonders for a worn out whore or stripper.
STEP 8 - Get your mind off sex work. Take a class, go to a funny movie, hang out with children or old people. Make a list of the ten activities that make you most happy, and then do them.
STEP 9 - Be willing to make less money. Don't let the client determine the service. Let the client know what YOU offer. Practice saying “NO”. Clean out your little black book. Decide what kinds of people you want to work with, and be willing to let those that don't fit the bill go by. Develop your own style.
STEP 10 - Create other sources of income. Look into other businesses and career opportunities. Go to college or trade school, start a sideline so that you won't feel financially trapped. When you need a break from sex work, you'll have an alternate source of income.
STEP 11 - Take a break from sex. Hey, you don’t HAVE to be sexy ALL the time! Give yourself a period of not having sex. This can help recharge your battery.
STEP 12 - If your SWBO is chronic, get the hell out of the business. Perhaps you're simply not cut out for sex work, it's not fulfilling your needs, or it's time for a change. You may need to leave the biz gradually, or it or go 'cold turkey'. If there's a will, there's always a way.
TAKE GOOD CARE OF YOUR PRECIOUS SELF. YOU’RE WORTH IT!
Yep, how to be a better lover INDEED, rofl. you fucking idiot.
what do you mean they "couldn't go back into legitimate work"? they NEVER wanted to have a "normal" job. how do you know they couldn't go back into normal work when THEY NEVER TRIED TO GO BACK INTO NORMAL WORK? their busts didn't harm them at all from pursuing the career THEY ALWAYS WANTED. did you bother to read their bios at all?
You dont know either of them personally, so you have no idea whether they tried to go back into legitimate work or not. I, do happen to know a lot more than you do. Besides, you of all people, with an SO in the business of entertainment, should know bios are about HYPE, and you dont divulge everything about your life in your bio.
Look, I'm tired of having this same argument with you.
Translated: "Im tired of losing and having to spin everything you say into something that makes me feel like I am right because I dont like to be wrong"
Please prove my point by posting another picture that most 6 year olds would find funny.
my 7 year old daughter thought this one was fucking hilarious:
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 01:41 AM
ZOMG, classes for hookers. :delirious:
I can see it now:
How to Choose Your Pimp 101 (complete with a lab on how to avoid the pesky pimp slap)
Location, Location, Location: Choosing a corner that works for you
Thigh-Highs or Knee-Highs?: How to dress appropriately for your john
Wash it, Honey!: How to launder your illegal money
OMFG, what is THAT?: How to identify most bumps and avoid STDs
No, it's more like this:
PhD Dissertation: Educating Sex Workers
ABSTRACT
PROVIDING EDUCATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES FOR SEX WORKERS
Annie Sprinkle, Ph.D.
Former Prostitute/Porn Star turned Sexologist/Artist
In most industries today, workers and their employers take for granted that they will continue to learn more about their career fields. They expect to hone their skills, practice new approaches, and learn about the latest technologies and research advances. However, it is not readily apparent that sex workers have an awareness of continuing education being available for their types of work.
This dissertation researches the existing educational opportunities for sex workers and provides an overview of who offers what. Various organizations, private websites, workshops, videos, health clinics, therapists, conferences and other sources, offer education of various kinds, and for various reasons.
This dissertation then surveys 150 sex workers’ attitudes toward career-related education, their levels of interest, and exactly what they’re interested in learning. Results are tabulated by job description, level of industry experience, and age of the respondents. The overall response was highly favorable toward education. The most popular course topics (out of 28 choices) were, in order, Legal Issues, Career Enhancement, Financial Advice, Super Sex Technologies, Self Defense, and the History of Sex Work. The classes least of interest were, in order, Advanced Safer Sex Techniques, Building Self Esteem, and How to Be A Better Lover.
Next a focus group of sex workers and sex worker educators was assembled. The survey results were shared with this panel of experts who analyzed and discussed them. The group first noticed that the most popular classes were similar to those that would also be of most interest to self-employed individuals in other industries: career-specific skills, and classes in marketing, legal and financial issues. The panel felt that education was very important for the workers, their clientelle and ultimately society at large, and that professional success relies on the same criteria in any business.
They discussed the challenges of educating sex workers, and offered advice for how to best market ‘a sex worker school’ to sex workers, to many of whom the concept would be wholly unfamiliar. Questions regarding legality consituted a huge barrier to teaching some of the topics. Other issues of importance were attitudes such as lack of self esteem of some sex workers, or the feeling that the job was “temporary” so no education was desired. It was determined that it would be beneficial to build support for sex worker empowerment and self esteem into the course design, but not to make it too obvious when marketing the course. The panel also identified the traits of good sex worker educators.
This research resulted in the design of a three day course specifically created to meet the needs of sex workers as identified. Plans are presently being made to implement this comprehensive course for sex workers. The course is called Sex Worker Education and Training, or “The SWEAT”.
That's the abstract from Annie's dissertation for her PhD (obviously, since it says so at the top lol)...
here's the full thing:
http://www.anniesprinkle.org/media/dissertation.pdf
You should read it, and maybe learn yourself something, instead of acting like you know it all ;)
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-22, 01:45 AM
Dude, out of your list of 40 things whores are, I got to #2.
Plenty of whores have no sense of humor what so ever. They're constantly at internal odds with themselves for what they do "for a living" and have really shitty attitudes.
You're using 2 people you know via anecdotal evidence to try to prop up some arguement, I'm not even positive what you're arguing anymore.
There are books, documentaries, etc, by the boatload where women talk about how being involved in prostitution, and even stripping, was damaging to their psychological health and sense of self. You're giving exceptions, women being harmed by that lifestyle is the general rule.
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 01:48 AM
p.s. successful troll is successful ;)
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-22, 01:50 AM
p.s. successful troll is successful ;)
Ri-hi-hi-hi-ight.
"Oh hai guyz! I dun really care abt this arguement!"
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 01:58 AM
There are books, documentaries, etc, by the boatload where women talk about how being involved in prostitution, and even stripping, was damaging to their psychological health and sense of self.
Also, there are also books, documentaries, tv shows, movies, seminars etc by the boatload where women talk about how being involved in prostitution, and even stripping, was good for their psychological health and sense of self...
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 02:01 AM
Dude, out of your list of 40 things whores are, I got to #2.
its not my list ;)
Plenty of whores have no sense of humor what so ever. They're constantly at internal odds with themselves for what they do "for a living" and have really shitty attitudes.
plenty of non-whores have no sense of humor whatsoever - present company in this thread for example ;)
I'm not even positive what you're arguing anymore.
See successful troll is successful post :)
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-22, 02:05 AM
Also, there are also books, documentaries, tv shows, movies, seminars etc by the boatload where women talk about how being involved in prostitution, and even stripping, was good for their psychological health and sense of self...
I'd be interested in a list, as I haven't seen or heard of any.
I think at this point you're just making shit up.
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-22, 02:07 AM
plenty of non-whores have no sense of humor whatsoever - present company in this thread for example ;)
I don't know how you'd judge that from this thread, since nothing you said was remotely funny.
See successful troll is successful post :)
And what, you got people to argue with you on the buzzboard?
I'm really happy for you, and I'ma let you finish, but blahblahblahblahblahblahblahblah.
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 02:21 AM
I'd be interested in a list, as I haven't seen or heard of any.
I think at this point you're just making shit up.
Ive already named one book in this thread, by dolores, "My Life as a Prostitute"
Then there's the "Cathouse" series on HBO, where most of the girls talk up their experiences in a good way, with the ones who cant handle what they're doing being the exceptions
And then there's "Pornucpoia", also on HBO with porn stars and strippers talking about in various episodes of the empowerment, etc...
There's the book "Sex for sale: prostitution, pornography, and the sex industry By Ronald John Weitzer" that details that yes, while street workers have issues with esteem, but the larger group of prostitutes aka indoor workers - call girls, brothel workers, massage parlor girls etc - having good experiences, taking pride in their work, and using it as a boost to ego and self esteem...
and so on and so forth...
just because you havent seen or heard of stuff, doesnt mean it isnt out there...
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 06:17 PM
Those lists that you've posted: except for maybe 12 and 11, it's just general advice on how to take good care of yourself.
I already have. Show me on their sites where they are actively soliciting johns.
You dont know either of them personally, so you have no idea whether they tried to go back into legitimate work or not. I, do happen to know a lot more than you do. Besides, you of all people, with an SO in the business of entertainment, should know bios are about HYPE, and you dont divulge everything about your life in your bio.
Here's another example of where you sandbag yourself:
YOU: I already have [proven you wrong]. Show me on their sites where they are actively soliciting johns.
YOU (in the same POST for christsakes): [YOU] should know bios are about HYPE, and you dont divulge everything about your life in your bio.
You just proved yourself wrong. In one breathe you said that a person can't prove something if it's not posted on their website and then in the same breathe said that people don't divulge everything on their website. According to the latter, posted by YOU, it is possible that they have Johns they are not actively advertising.
An example, one of Annie's writings and teachings:
You didn't even read what you posted or you didn't understand it. You realize what a dissertation is, right? It's where people set up circumstances to mimic real life circumstances in order to study them in a more controlled environment. According to what YOU posted, this person is not actively giving seminars, but is collecting data on what is out there in terms of education (which is not much, otherwise she couldn't have written a dissertation on it, you can't write a dissertation on something that's already been proven/researched), surveys sex workers to determine their attitudes and what they would like to learn IF they took a class, then discussed challenges of educating sex workers in order to set up a THREE DAY ONLY COURSE in order for her to write about it for her dissertation. She is NOT actively giving seminars.
She is planning on doing it if she thinks it will be profitable. She says herself: "Questions regarding legality consituted a huge barrier to teaching some of the topics. Other issues of importance were attitudes such as lack of self esteem of some sex workers, or the feeling that the job was “temporary” so no education was desired." She realizes that the "seminar" may not be successful.
Again, something you've posted proves my point. I postulated that most female sex workers have low self-esteem. Annie Sprinkle, in what you've posted, talks at length about a woman prostitute's self-esteem, or lack thereof and how a PRIMARY FUNCTION of the course would be to build it up. Who is going to listen to you over someone who has their PhD in this kind of thing? You unprovable anecdotes don't prove anything.
I'm not against psychoeducation for sex workers, if this proves to be beneficial, then I would be all for it. I'm just saying that outside the porno/stripping industry, it's not something that most people see or that most of society wants or thinks they would even benefit from.
and Alan, what's the difference between a Troll and Douchebag?
Nothing. You don't need to tell us you're a troll/douchebag. We already know.
zarbizarre
2009-09-22, 07:28 PM
lol u so butthurt from clocking losses you went ahead and typed out a bunch of snoreagraphs that im never gonna read... frustrating isnt it? :D
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-22, 07:52 PM
smart move to give up while you're so far behind and completely outwitted.
badkitty3804
2009-09-22, 10:15 PM
I'd be interested in a list, as I haven't seen or heard of any.
I think at this point you're just making shit up.
Look into 3rd wave feminism reading, there are well educated and successful women with pasts and presents as sex workers that have sanity with differing moral codes.
One that comes to mind immediately is "Janes Sexes It Up" by Merri Lisa Johnson (aka - Former Stripper with a phd). And that same writer was also involved in "Flesh for Fantasy", which was written in full by a GROUP of ex-sex workers that are also academics.
And there was recently, as in the past 2-3 years, a heavy trendy of memoirs put out there by sex workers. Typically found in either the Women's studies or Sociology section of book stores.
Also, there are plenty of documentaries out there. "Live Nude Girls Unite" was a fascinating documentary on the attempts of dancers for unionization - which I fully support. And while I don't know of any right off, I'm sure that there's plenty of books or documentaries on the Dominatrix biz.
I don't think that anyone in this thread is trying to glamorize the industry. But you can't completely generalize it as being a negative and utterly destructive thing either.
badkitty3804
2009-09-22, 10:39 PM
The fatal flaw in the empowerment argument is that you can only use your sexuality to prop up your self-esteem for so long. If prostitution was so empowering, every woman would do, they would give seminars on it. There's a reason it's usually only the poor, desperate and destitute who pursue that line of work.
I dunno Emily, if there was poison being sold in a product and one person died and/or was injured from it, wouldn't you pull it from the shelf? I can promise you, prostitution is far more damaging to a woman's self-esteem then most people probably realize. I feel part of our government's job is to protect us, and outlawing prostitution, I believe, helps do that.
I'll tell you one thing, no one's life is being irrevocably harmed by the illegalization of prostitution, so I think the pros against the legalization of prostitution far outweigh the cons.
Have you ever spoken to a sex worker hon? You're working off of a lot of assumptions and stereotypes.
And your poison/prostitution simile doesn't work -
1.) The gov't is perfectly okay with leaving things on the market until they kill many people. It would much rather hop on the tails of a moral battle and tends to react to bad PR more so that an actualized sensitivity to "protecting us".
2.) A product that kills versus an adult chosing a path that *could* be destructive? Really? Come on, you're smarter than that. I can go out an choose a number of paths that would do horrible damage to me either mentally or physically in a legal manner. It's not the government's position to play mommy.
3.) Public humiliation of those arrested is okay now? Innocent until proven guilty anyone? You can't see the PR push in this? And this is going to reform those involved how? Good thing those prostitutes will be behind bars with all of those rapists, murderers, thieves and gang members!
My biggest problem with this is the fact that it was a sting operation. More than likely, they had to infiltrate the services going on to get into the ring. This means that the rings were operating under the radar and not just a bunch of women hanging out on the street and asking guys driving by for a quickie. Which further perpetuates that this is a morally based operation rather than something to "protect and serve" civilians. And as I noted earlier, its very troubling to hear about a police for putting out this level of energy on something when so many other crimes, far more dangerous crimes to society, are going on and simply being ignored.
This may not be a career you'd take part it, this is obvious, but it's been a career option for longer than most fields out there and will continue to be. Leave out the morals for a moment and look at it objectively - the gov't is okay with Corporations and banks ruining people, Food Industry killing us and destroying our planet, removing homeless shelters (like in DC), ignoring the basic issues associated with health care....but feels the need to step in when it comes to consensual sex between adults? You don't see ANY problem with this?
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-23, 12:29 AM
Have you ever spoken to a sex worker hon? You're working off of a lot of assumptions and stereotypes.
I'm actually not making any assumptions. I would *never* do that. I'm actually going off the intense psychotherapeutic work I've done WITH "prostitutes". I put that in quotes because the types of prostitutes I'm talking about don't dress up and hang out on street corners, they look and dress very average and just happen to sleep with men or whoever on the side for extra money.
What I pointed out a few posts ago (not that I expect anyone to wade through all the drama), is that Annie Sprinkle, who apparently created a three day sex worker workshop as part of her dissertation project when getting her PhD in Philosophy, pointed out that the one of the MAIN issues she wanted to work on with prostitutes is to raise their self-esteem. Looking through her bio, it seems as if she's devoted her whole life to being, and studying what it means to be, a prostitute. If SHE says that self-esteem is one of the main issues, I tend to believe her.
Also, I postulated earlier in the thread that people who are GOOD at what they do, rarely get caught. Using Annie Sprinkle as an example, she worked for 20 years as a hooker and never got busted. I don't think outlawing prostitution stops the people who truly like their job from being a prostitute. Because I don't think it keeps them from what they want, and because their life is not irrevocably damaged even if they are caught, and because prostitution itself IS detrimental to so many women, I don't think illegalizing prostitution is a bad thing.
1.) The gov't is perfectly okay with leaving things on the market until they kill many people. It would much rather hop on the tails of a moral battle and tends to react to bad PR more so that an actualized sensitivity to "protecting us".
2.) A product that kills versus an adult chosing a path that *could* be destructive? Really? Come on, you're smarter than that. I can go out an choose a number of paths that would do horrible damage to me either mentally or physically in a legal manner. It's not the government's position to play mommy.
We'll have to agree to disagree. I think in some ways it is very much the job of government to police society. Do they always do a perfect job? No. Are policies and laws sometimes hypocritical? Sure. But I would rather live like this than live in anarchy (which is impossible by the way, society would fall into clusters of mob rule, like they did in parts of "Russia" after communism fell).
3.) Public humiliation of those arrested is okay now? Innocent until proven guilty anyone? You can't see the PR push in this? And this is going to reform those involved how? Good thing those prostitutes will be behind bars with all of those rapists, murderers, thieves and gang members!
See, that's the thing. If they LOVE what they do, they're not humiliated by it. Was Legba humiliated by anything negative anyone said about him due to his placing of the memorial bikes? No. He didn't give a shit, because he was proud and sure of what he was doing. If these women feel the same way about their profession, they will not feel humiliated, no matter what society says.
If they ARE humiliated, then it's good they got arrested so now they will be mandated by the courts to get the psychological help they need. I know, because my organization gets some of its business from court-referrals. If they don't have prior records, many of them won't serve much time and can even trade in hard time by contracting to go to therapy for X amount of months.
My biggest problem with this is the fact that it was a sting operation. More than likely, they had to infiltrate the services going on to get into the ring. This means that the rings were operating under the radar and not just a bunch of women hanging out on the street and asking guys driving by for a quickie. Which further perpetuates that this is a morally based operation rather than something to "protect and serve" civilians. And as I noted earlier, its very troubling to hear about a police for putting out this level of energy on something when so many other crimes, far more dangerous crimes to society, are going on and simply being ignored.
But Emily, if these women didn't really want this career and just fell into it through hard times, the govt. actually may have SAVED them. At least in MD if this happened, they can get uninsured coverage which entitles them to free physical and mental health care.
This may not be a career you'd take part it, this is obvious, but it's been a career option for longer than most fields out there and will continue to be. Leave out the morals for a moment and look at it objectively - the gov't is okay with Corporations and banks ruining people, Food Industry killing us and destroying our planet, removing homeless shelters (like in DC), ignoring the basic issues associated with health care....but feels the need to step in when it comes to consensual sex between adults? You don't see ANY problem with this?
The govt. is far, FAR from perfect, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Just because I'm unhappy with their stance on the food industry, etc., doesn't mean they should do away with laws that *I* feel are fair and working.
The bottom line for me is that prostitution HURTS far more people than it helps, and that getting caught in and of itself does not ruin a woman's life forever, and that people who are good at it don't get caught or move to where it's legal, so I think outlawing it is a better solution than legalizing it.
zarbizarre
2009-09-23, 03:05 AM
If SHE says that self-esteem is one of the main issues, I tend to believe her.
lolwut?
The classes least of interest were, in order, Advanced Safer Sex Techniques, Building Self Esteem, and How to Be A Better Lover.
zarbizarre
2009-09-23, 03:10 AM
her PhD in Philosophy
PhD in HUMAN SEXUALITY from the Institute of Advanced Study of Human Sexuality.
Reading is fundamental.
zarbizarre
2009-09-23, 03:37 AM
so I think outlawing it is a better solution than legalizing it.
In places where it is legal, the health of prostitutes is overseen by the government and they are required to get regularly tested for STDs and are medically supervised, thus helping stop the spread of disease. There are no "pimps" or criminal elements involved. The government also collects taxes from them, thus helping the economy. Also, with it being legal, the women/men engaging in the acts do not have to hide it, and thus can be made safer by not having to perform acts in places such as alleys, on the streets, in cars, etc.
In places where it is illegal, it is a "black market" commodity... with this, comes more crime, much like the with drugs being illegal. Since it is illegal, there is no legal recourse for things such as non payment, they are not required by law to get regularly tested for STDs, and they do not pay taxes.
By keeping it illegal and underground, it does more harm than good to society. By attempting to stop it, it brings in criminal elements, such as pimps, the mafia, etc. who beat the women if they dont pay their percentages for "protection", abuse them, and even go as far as murdering them. In addition, having it illegal aids the illegal slave trade and women being sold into sex trafficking.
Exploitation from pimps disappears with the legalization of prostitution.
Also, according to Paul Abramson, Ph.D., Steven Pinkerton, Ph.D., and Mark Huppin, J.D., Ph.D., who all wrote in "Sexual America":
"Prostitution is consistent with the pursuit of happiness of both prostitutes and the men who visit them. Moreover, to the (somewhat questionable) extent that the availability of commercial sex partners channels excess male sexual energy away from the wives of other men (thereby preventing adultery) or unwilling sexual partners (thereby preventing rape and sexual assault), prostitution is beneficial in a broader sense."
zarbizarre
2009-09-23, 04:16 AM
<OL TYPE=I>
<LI><A HREF="#introduction">Introduction</A>
<LI><A HREF="#cultural">Cultural Differences</A>
<LI><A HREF="#sex">Sex Within Monogamous Societies</A>
<LI><A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A>
<LI><A HREF="#benefits">Benefits of Legalization</A>
<LI><A HREF="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A>
<LI><A HREF="#role">The Role of Government</A>
<LI><A HREF="#comparing">Comparing Prostitution Rights to Abortion Rights</A>
<LI><A HREF="#religion">Religion Shapes the Economy Through the Family</A>
<LI><A HREF="#scientists">Scientists May Find Answers Through Research</A>
<LI><A HREF="#data">Data Driven Analysis</A>
<OL TYPE=A>
<LI><A HREF="#crimedata">Crime Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#healthcaredata">Healthcare Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#socialconditionsdata">Social Conditions Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#summary">Summary</A>
</OL>
<LI><A HREF="#management">Management vs. Abandonment</A>
<LI><A HREF="#prostitution">Prostitution as a Career Choice</A>
<LI><A HREF="#conclusion">Conclusion</A>
<LI><A HREF="#resources">Resources</A>
<LI><A HREF="#related">Related Articles on The Liberator</A>
</OL>
<P><FONT SIZE=3 FACE="Arial">
<OL TYPE=I>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#introduction">Introduction</A></B>
<BR>With the invention of males and females came the constant need for negotiation, as history indicates. Some civilizations were based on male dominance and rewarded those who possessed strength, innate tactical intelligence and traits generally present in males. This explains why many civilizations have not been kind to women. A small number of civilizations did honor women, but women have never been able to achieve equal status with men.
<P>
Women have not always been able to escape the role of housewife or gain a political voice. Only in recent human history have women been able to obtain relative equality. They have been able to make great gains through a considerable amount of achievements, no need to list here. Yet to this day, men and women have specialized roles within societies, differing only slightly in some countries and greatly in other countries.
<P>
[<A HREF="#top">Return to top.</A>]
<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#cultural">Cultural Differences</A></B>
<BR>Each culture deals differently with heterosexuality. Most cultures encourage monogamy, while countries like Saudi Arabia have adopted polygyny. Even within societies that safeguard or promote monogamous relations, there are allowances for citizens to have many types of sexual relations. People can remain monogamous to one person at time or date multiple partners simultaneously. People can have open marriages (a.k.a. swinging) or exist within monogamous relationships and be covertly promiscuous (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>). There are also people who frequent prostitutes regardless of the law.
<P>
<TABLE ALIGN=right BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=3><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR><TR><TD ALIGN=left WIDTH=280><FONT COLOR=red FACE="Times" SIZE=5><B>“Instead of managing the problem through the medical and social interventions accompanied by regulation of the industry, critics of legalized prostitution would rather adopt prohibition and cold abandonment.”</B></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR></TABLE>
When we examine sex as a trade, the combination of philosophy, cultural precedence, religious influence and politics made each country select how to handle it in its own way. In Singapore, sex for money is open and commonplace. Denmark women can be legal prostitutes so long as it is not their sole means of income. Canada, France and Mexico allow it. Prostitutes must be contained within brothels in the Netherlands, unlike within England and Wales where prostitution is limited to individual providers. Israel, the historical stage for the Bible, allows it, too. Meanwhile, the United States has made prostitution illegal (misdemeanor) in all states, except certain counties of Nevada (<A HREF="#Decriminalize">Decriminalize Prostitution Now Coalition, 2000</A>).
<P>
Even though it is quite natural on a biological level for males and females to host desires and have intimate relations with many partners (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>), it would probably be a very unproductive line of reasoning when considering the legalization of prostitution. Humankind no longer succumbs to animal behavior and has built infrastructures that depend on us expunging primitive mannerisms. Unlike the animal kingdom, we deal with sexuality without force. Nevertheless, there is still room for prostitution within civilized societies, since sex can be considered to be a service traded for goods, services, relationships, and money.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#sex">Sex Within Monogamous Societies</A></B>
<BR>Sex sometimes becomes a bartered service even within the sanctity of marriage. One provides sex for love, while another provides love for sex. Someone else finds warmth and attention within the act of sex. Like ants who send chemical messages to each other to convey both intricate and basic messages, sex becomes part of that type of communication even within civilized relationships (<A HREF="Pines">Pines, n.d.</A> & <A HREF="#Malick">Malick, n.d.</A>). It is also a healthy outlet, too. We may not be animals who forage in forests but our desire for sex, or at least the actions, thoughts and feelings that come with it, are deeply part of whom we are.
<P>
A primal desire must not be ignored or suppressed, but instead managed. Within the sanctity of marriage, balancing acts must be performed to ensure each member of the team is getting what he or she needs. From cleaning the house, buying new furniture, displaying one's affection and releasing stress, sex gets caught up in the mix and can sometimes become a bargaining chip. It is as normal as doing a favor or performing an act of kindness, when one is not in the mood. Much like when a chore must be done, one may choose or not choose to do it, depending on extenuating circumstances or immediate pressing demands.
<P>
Sex, like everything else, is up on the table for 'sale' within marriage and other relationships. It is not a foreign concept to anyone who has ever been in a sexual relationship over an extended period of time. Usually there is no direct exchange of money, but natural exchanges in a give-and-take situation do occur when things are normal and healthy. So long as there are no heavy demands and freedom of choice exists, sex is a commodity of sorts.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A></B>
<BR>The United States is rooted on freedom of speech, religion and trade. The first two are specifically mentioned early on within The Constitution. Those inalienable rights are not given to us by The Constitution, but are instead protected by it. So why violate the premise by prohibiting relations between consenting adults?
<P>
Some people believe that governments can make better choices for us, but it wasn't a vision the Founding Fathers had when they created The Constitution. The U.S. government is designed mainly to be run by the people, which is in direct opposition to modern liberalism that insists it control people. Yet, morally conservative groups that adopted this liberal view of government passed the Eighteenth Amendment to prohibit the distribution and sale of alcohol.
<P>
Recall prohibition from 1920 to 1933 and remember the affects it had on alcohol consumption. Home producers created whiskey and bathtub gin. The price of alcohol skyrocketed in black market sales due to heavy demand and the greedy public officials who secretly monitored it, so it was believed. Bootlegging became an underground industry (<A HREF="#Nixon">Nixon, 2001</A>). As a result prohibition did literally nothing to actually prevent alcohol from being consumed by the public.
<P>
The government, and ultimately the public, suffered huge losses from prohibition. The government lost considerable amounts of tax dollars from bootlegged alcohol and it became impossible to regulate the quality, i.e. safety, of the product. In attempts to prohibit alcohol consumption through the Volstead Act, spending by the Bureau of Prohibition went from $4.4 million to $13.4 million annually. Spending by the Coast Guard was an average $13 million per year in the 1920s for prohibition alone (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>). In fact when per capita costs are analyzed, spending more to curb behavior did literally nothing against consumption, making a total mockery of law enforcement efforts.
<P>
Social irresponsibility of this magnitude during the depression was horrific when considering how these monies could have been spent to do good for society. Programs could have been developed to help the unemployed. Healthcare could have been expanded to include social programs to drive down high suicide rates.
<P>
It was thought prohibition would put an end to many social problems but it actually created many more. Increasing the number of laws runs a risk of creating more criminals, and that is exactly what had happened. Jails became filled. Government spending to pay for the housing and maintenance of these criminals went up (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>). Compounded by the lack of intake from alcohol tax, it placed huge dents on public coffers.
<P>
Prohibition caused many problems related to criminal activity. There was a causal link between prohibition and an increase in homicides. During prohibition, homicide rates increased over 66%. After prohibition was repealed on Dec. 5, 1933, the homicide rate immediately dropped and eventually reached pre-prohibition levels in the mid-1940s (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>).
<P>
The philosophy of prohibition came from many 'dry groups,' but the Anti-Saloon League working closely with the Woman's Christian Temperance Union were the driving forces in establishing prohibition (<A HREF="#Ohio">Ohio State University, 1997</A>). Politics, which is really about solving the problems society faces, became victimized by morally conservative lobbyists. They held a belief that a desire for spirits could be repressed instead of managed. We will see over the course of human history that the philosophy of repression and abolition bears no merit.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#benefits">Benefits of Legalization</A></B>
<BR>Currently most everywhere in the United States, our legal system penalizes prostitutes and their customers for what they do as consenting adults. Money is still spent on law enforcement efforts to catch prostitutes and their customers. Once caught, justice departments have to process these people through very expensive systems.
<P>
What are the end results? Police personnel and courtrooms are overburdened with these cases, having little or no impact on prostitution. The prostitutes and their customers pay their fines and are back to the streets in no time in a revolving door process. Catch and release may work for recreational fishing but it has no deterring affect on prostitution.
<P>
Making prostitution legal will allow the act to be managed instead of ignored. Pimps and organized crime figures, who regularly treat their workers on subhuman levels, would no longer control women. In some countries, prostitute rings buy and sell women on the black market, force their women to comply through violence and create unhealthy working conditions. When prostitutes operate independently and in secret, many times they become abused by their own customers.
<P>
Legalizing prostitution would prevent underground prostitution that occurs today. When men want to pay for sex, they find prostitutes. These people work in massage parlors, escort services, strip bars and modeling agencies or still work corners as traditional streetwalkers. There are legitimate parlors, dating services, bars and agencies but of the hundreds that exist within newspaper classified advertisements and telephone directories, there are a large number that provide sexual services. A routine search through Google's Internet news engine for 'prostitution' routinely reveals connections between prostitution and these falsetto agencies (<A HREF="#Google">Google, 2004</A>).
<P>
It is estimated that 100,000 to 3 million teens are nearly invisibly prostituted per year in the United States (<A HREF="#Walker">Walker, 2002</A>). If we allow prostitution to remain hidden from view and basically invisible to the law as it is today, we allow a number of teens to be swept up into prostitution every year. When adult women decide to exchange money for sex, it is a personal choice open to them under the philosophy of a free, democratic society. When troubled minors who do not yet have the social survival skills decide to prostitute, they are often manipulated by opportunists who exploit these teens, typically leading to horrific ends. Legalizing prostitution will help prevent these instances through regulation.
<P>
Legalized, regulated prostitution has many benefits. Encounters can happen within controlled environments that bring about safety for both the customers and the prostitutes. Prostitutes would no longer be strong-armed by pimps or organized crime rings. Underage prostitution would be curtailed. There would also be health-safety improvements.
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<LI>
<B><A NAME="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A></B>
<BR>The status quo is a poor health-safety plan. With sexually transmitted diseases (STDs) like syphilis, gonorrhea, chlamydia and herpes, prostitutes must be monitored to prevent the spread of these afflictions. Chancroid, a STD typically found in third world nations, is occurring in places throughout the U.S. due to transmission brought on through illegal prostitution (<A HREF="#Schmid">Schmid, Sanders, Blount & Alexander, 1987</A>). Chancroid makes ulcers in the vagina that assist with the spread of HIV/AIDS.
<P>
A Public Health Review of Chancroid from the World Health Organization stated:
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT FACE="Times">
In Kenya, where the importance of chancroid in HIV transmission was first described in the late 1980s, interventions targeting sex workers and STD patients were implemented. Reported condom use by sex workers has since increased to over 80% in project areas and the incidence of genital ulcers has declined. Chancroid, once the most common ulcer etiology, now accounts for fewer than 10% of genital ulcers seen in clinics in Nairobi, Kenya.
<P>
In Senegal, HIV prevalence among pregnant women has been below 1% for more than a decade. A strong multisectoral response, an effective STD control programme and early legalization of prostitution have been credited for this low level. Special clinical services, for example, offer regular examination and treatment for registered sex workers. Not only has there been a significant decline in STD rates among sex workers and pregnant women between 1991 and 1996, but genital ulcers are also no longer common and chancroid is reportedly rare.
</FONT>(<A HREF="#Steen">Steen, 2001</A>)</BLOCKQUOTE>
Steen cited a practical example of how government can help its citizens. It makes practical sense to monitor prostitution and what better way is there to monitor it than by legalizing it and regulating it? Legalization would require prostitutes to undergo regular medical examinations. STDs would be prevented from being spread as well as other communicable ailments like hepatitis and tuberculosis. It would also reduce gender violence, allow women to escape prostitution, if they so choose, and prevent women from becoming infertile as a consequence to obtaining certain STDs (<A HREF="#Gavin">Gavin, 2001</A>).
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<LI>
<B><A NAME="#role">The Role of Government</A></B>
<BR>Whether one is a liberal or conservative, republican or democrat, the role of government is to carry out necessary duties its citizens cannot perform. Politicians are elected to government positions to solve the problems countries face. Some Democratic politicians insist government should be designed to act as a safety net for people who need help, by providing citizens with various social programs including public safety and healthcare entitlements. Other Republican representatives believe in freedom of choice through responsible action and rather institute high standards in education and healthcare to enable citizens with opportunities. Libertarians feel compelled to ensure civil rights and allow citizens to be self-governing members of society.
<P>
In these cases, the issue of morality aside, it can be plainly seen how each political view contains strong elements supporting legalization. Maintaining the status quo has the U.S. throwing tax dollars away by spending it on law enforcement, criminal justice and prisons. The U.S. healthcare system is currently reactionary at best; it passively handles STDs after they occur instead of instituting mechanisms to prevent them from happening in the first place. Political philosophy has not changed from immaturity and clings to a prohibitory model from the 1920s, even though it was proven to be devastating to its citizens [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above].
<P>
The best way to understand the current state of affairs concerning prostitution is to entertain an analogy. Pretend government is a business. Politicians would be the managers and prostitution would be a certain procedure the company had to manage. Would a successful business ignore a procedure when it performed poorly? Would it allow a poor procedure to continue or would a successful business instead rethink its position and improve it? All successful companies must evolve over time if they are to stay in business and excel. Fortunately, the U.S. Constitution allows its citizens to view government like a dynamic business because it is a work in progress. Laws can change and adapt to meet the demands of a modern civilization. It is a far better strategy than hoping it will go away and clean up itself.
<P>
Where are the limits for two consenting adults in privacy? How government is shaped to handle that question will decide how women's rights, social programs, public healthcare, the safety of youth and possibly the general safety of citizens are valued. If moral obstacles prevent citizens from obtaining a government that helps its people while preserving freedoms, then a paradigm shift must be considered. A movement away from values that are harmful is difficult only if one decides to cling to outdated, self-destructive traditions.
<P>
Politicians should be careful how they address the philosophical limits of adult privacy. A number of people believe government should have no right deciding how adults conduct their sexual lives, even when an exchange of money is involved. Public debate has already addressed a women's rights issue that is connected to a similar freedom.
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<LI>
<B><A NAME="#comparing">Comparing Prostitution Rights to Abortion Rights</A></B>
<BR>Abortion was decided to be legal by The Supreme Court in 1973 in a landmark case: Roe vs. Wade. Intellectuals have weighed the issue and decided in favor for women's rights in part due to public safety.
<P>
<TABLE ALIGN=right BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=3><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR><TR><TD ALIGN=left WIDTH=280><FONT COLOR=red FACE="Times" SIZE=5><B>“If modern society rests itself on principles claiming to assist those who cannot help themselves and create structures where opportunities, not dead ends, are the norm, then these lower strata prostitutes do not deserve the abandonment from which they are suffering.”</B></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR></TABLE>
Considering the safety gains, the decision was proper, despite perpetual moral objections from religious groups ignoring longstanding facts to this day. Pre-1973, 17% of all deaths due to pregnancy and childbirth were the result of illegal abortions. Pre-1973, 1.2 million women resorted to illegal abortions yearly and botched illegal abortions caused as many as 5,000 deaths a year. Untrained physician in unsanitary conditions using primitive methods often performed illegal abortions (<A HREF="#Planned">Planned Parenthood, 2002</A>).
<P>
As with the treatment of alcohol in the '20s, prohibiting abortions did not stop them. In fact, illegal abortions were commonplace and hazardous to the health of women. Again we see the outcome of a prohibitory philosophy [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above]. The facts indicate we must abandon abolitionist thinking and insist society rest on what is best for it. Traditionalists would disagree, but what evidence do they use to support their opinion?
<P>
The Christian group partly responsible for prohibition in the '20s now takes an interesting view concerning abolition. The Women's Christian Temperance Union states on its official website "Temperance may be defined as: moderation in all things healthful; total abstinence from all things harmful" (<A HREF="#WCTU">Women's Christian Temperance Union, n.d.</A>). Originating from a religious group that played a part in the prohibition disaster, it appears to have undergone a paradigm shift.
<P>
The quote is an interesting one, coming from an organization having ties to values generally thought to be moral. Certain religious groups insist society not be corrupted by negative behaviors and consequently ban them. This group must now see the futility of such a position, which brings us hope for other morally centered organizations. Regardless, the quote was from the insightful Greek philosopher Xenophon (400 B.C.), who lived in a time when prostitution was legal and often performed within temples (<A HREF="#Baldwin">Baldwin, 2004</A>).
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#religion">Religion Shapes the Economy Through the Family</A></B>
<BR>Either by observing nature, tackling the problems of humankind or listening to persons claiming divine inspiration, religionists proclaim they know what is good for us. Consequently, they seek to shape society. Sometimes they shape society through dogma or lobby politicians to pass ordinances and laws. Their strength comes from an ability to mobilize groups and form organizations.
<P>
It was probably thought pairing men and women while punishing those who stray from monogamy was a way of keeping people productive. Purpose does tend to fall to the wayside when people are constantly at odds due to promiscuity. Families on the other hand promote other families and the dependence on those families creates stabilization.
<P>
When societies are stable, religionists may argue, greater deeds are possible to accomplish. We invent tools, find medical cures and create works of art that elevate the human spirit. It enables humankind to manufacture materials, offer services and develop trade locally or abroad. Monogamy, it is seen, gave birth to the present-day economy.
<P>
Religionists, economists and successful philanthropists want to preserve the status quo model. 'Why change a good thing?' would be their argument. To that, one would have to point to the futility of prohibitionist philosophies. Alcohol consumption of the 1920s along with present-day indicators (like homicide rates, divorce rates and continued women's rights issues) might tell us a different story. Is a desire for a steady-state economy at the expense of citizens a good long-range plan?
<P>
Maybe the entire economy depends on the family, or does it? In a capitalistic country, like The United States, the economy is tied mainly to the goods it sells. The more consumers and the more they purchase, the better off the country is as a whole. Having and promoting families is a way of continuing the steady-state economy.
<P>
However, the only guarantee from this attachment to a steady-state model is the production of children, not the production of families. Let the statistics of marriage speak for themselves. The average length of a marriage is 7.2 years. 50% of marriages fail, while 60% of remarriages fail. Roughly 1 million children per year become directly affected by divorce (<A HREF="#Divorce Magazine">Divorce Magazine, n.d.</A>). It is clear too many marriages end poorly for a high number of children in the United States, making the mainstream religionist's premise within the U.S. faulty.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#scientists">Scientists May Find Answers Through Research</A></B>
<BR>
There are bigger questions here that go beyond the scope of this investigation into legalized prostitution. Is the pursuit of the elusive family dependant upon having children? When many marriages fail, what value is there to families? What are the societal consequences of producing so many children without the structure of two-parent homes? There appears to be a need for change of the way religionists and society handles monogamy, marriage, and the family in the not so distant future.
<P>
Population scientists agree there are already many concerns related to having too many people. The very model that sustains a modern capitalistic country -- goods combined with an increasing consumer base -- is having a detrimental impact on ecological levels. Pollution of air, water, land and sound is already evident and is no longer mere theory.
<P>
Humans, unlike successful species, never left a colonization mode, which needs to be altered. Producing large quantities of offspring is necessary only when natural conditions, like numerous predators or inhospitable environments, prevent young from producing offspring of their own. This is no longer the case. Now, human survival may already depend on decreased growth or zero population growth. Moves toward that goal would require a different worldview with different mores.
<P>
One social dynamic to consider is serial monogamy. When people are left to naturally gravitate toward relationships without strong economic, moral, or legal forces, serial monogamy is often chosen and the lifelong monogamous relationship ideal is abandoned. There is even biological and psychological justification to defend this practice (<A HREF="#Casad">Casad, n.d.</A>).
<P>
Other social dynamics to consider are of a non-monogamous nature. Only 2% of all species are monogamous. Chimpanzees, the closest relative to the human species, practice "group marriages". With socio-biological urges guiding humans toward sexual diversity, maintaining monogamy as the social norm can be viewed as peculiar at best (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>). It certainly explains divorce rates and the problem of promiscuity in countries holding monogamy to unwarranted high regard.
<P>
Yet if the current, haphazard child production model is abandoned, where will social scientists look for a replacement model? Globalization may have them looking at other countries to see what works and what does not work while still preserving women's rights and maintaining high healthcare standards and other important social factors.
<P>
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<LI>
<B><A NAME="#data">Data Driven Analysis</A></B>
<BR>If society must accurately decide whether regulated prostitution is better than illegal prostitution, then scientists must analyze the wealth of information that exists. Social scientists and common voting citizens must look at data from countries having legal prostitution and compare them to The United States. Canada, the Netherlands, Mexico, and France have legal forms of prostitution as does Israel, Greece, Denmark, Singapore and the United Kingdom. Saudi Arabia allows polygyny and Iran offers "temporary wives". Examining these countries in the broad areas of crime, healthcare, and social conditions will help determine if prostitution should be legalized.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=0>
<TR><TD VALIGN=top><FONT FACE="Times">Note: </FONT></TD><TD><FONT FACE="Times">All statistics, save for two, are per capita. One statistic indicates government spending on education as a percent of gross domestic product. The other is a mean age for life expectancy. Standardizing these values with the use of rates (indicator per 1000 members), percents, and means allows one to compare these countries without a need to introduce differences in population. Entries of "X" indicate values that were either unreported by respective governments or were unavailable by statistics agencies used by Nation Master (<A HREF="#Nation">n.d.</A>).</FONT></TD></TR></TABLE>
<P>
<OL TYPE=A>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="crimedata">Crime</A></B>
<BR>Crime is a word used to describe taboo behaviors in a society. Each society defines it and enacts punishments to counter it differently. In Table 1 below, we will find comparative statistics on serious crimes and information on how criminals are pursued. Murders, rapes, the number of adults prosecuted, and number of prisoners per country are listed.
<P>
Serious crimes are high in the United States. The U.S. places second on the murder list. The only country with a higher rate is Mexico. The U.S. has nearly half the murders as Mexico, but has two and a half times as many murders as Canada. When looking at rape data, the U.S. is second on the list, with Canada topping it. The U.S. rate is slightly less than half of Canada's rate, but more than double France's rate. The United States sits firmly in second place with these two violent crimes.
<P>
The United States has problems with violent crime despite great efforts to prosecute criminals and imprison them. The U.S. prosecutes almost five times the number of people as Canada and over eight times the number that Mexico reports. The U.S. is also unrivaled in terms of imprisonment. France comes the closest to the U.S.'s number of inmates, confining one-sixth the number as the U.S.
<P>
It is unknown if there is a correlation between laws that prohibit sex and higher crime rates, but the reverse appears to be more enlightening. The countries where prostitution is legal do not suffer from a high number of violent crimes. It appears legalized prostitution does not make societies more of a crime hazard. Contrary to the prohibitionist's philosophy, this data may give reason to implement and regulate prostitution to reduce crime because crime in countries where prostitution is legal is lower than the U.S.'s rates.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=5><B><A NAME="crimetable">Table 1</A>: <I>Crime</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>Murders<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Rapes<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Adults<BR>Prosecuted<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Prisoners<BR>per 1000</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>0.02</TD><TD>0.75</TD><TD>11.8</TD><TD>1.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.09</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>0.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>0.02</TD><TD>0.14</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>0.13</TD><TD>0.13</TD><TD>0.6</TD><TD>1.5</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.1</TD><TD>11.0</TD><TD>0.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.14</TD><TD>25.2</TD><TD>1.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>0.32</TD><TD>50.6</TD><TD>6.4</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="healthcaredata">Healthcare</A></B>
<BR>We recognize the general level of compassion and technological ability of a country in part by its ability to provide healthcare to its citizens. Laws, societal trends, and healthcare distribution also determine how a country will react to these variables. In Table 2 below, we will find data on HIV/AIDS rates and life expectancy levels for various countries.
<P>
The United States is tied at first place with the U.K. when it comes to the number of people per capita who live with HIV/AIDS. In Israel, where prostitution is legal, they suffer from nearly an eighth of the U.S.'s number. The U.K. aside, legal prostitution does not appear to have a negative impact on the spread of HIV/AIDS. In fact, there is evidence [see <A HREF="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A> above] to support the positive effects of legalizing prostitution on the spread of HIV/AIDS.
<P>
The U.S. is number one on the list for number of people dying of HIV/AIDS. There are many reasons to explain this fact even though the U.K. has an equal number of people infected with HIV/AIDS living in the country, but none of those reasons have to do with the legalization of prostitution. It may be a bit perplexing to prohibitionists when a country with legalized prostitution, like Canada, has a seventh of the number of HIV/AIDS infections as the U.S.
<P>
When looking at mean life expectancy by country, the result is less than special. There appears to be no causal relation between life expectancy and prostitution laws. However, the six countries that have higher life expectancies do have legal forms of prostitution, making it clear that prostitution does not negatively affect longevity.
<P>
There is a strong rationale for legalizing prostitution by regulating the industry, thereby monitoring sex workers and consequently the clients they serve. Allowing prostitution to remain invisible only perpetuates the spread of sometimes-deadly sexually transmitted diseases. A containment model based on managing the problem is better than an abolitionist model based on ignoring it, hoping it one day goes away all by itself.
<P>
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=4><B><A NAME="healthcaretable">Table 2</A>: <I>Healthcare</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>People Living<BR>with HIV/AIDS<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>HIV/AIDS Deaths<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Mean Life<BR>Expectancy</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>79.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>0.8</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>76.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>2.2</TD><TD>0.03</TD><TD>79.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>0.8</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>78.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>70.3</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>0.4</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>78.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>72.0</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>78.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>68.4</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>80.3</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>3.0</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>78.0</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>3.0</TD><TD>0.07</TD><TD>77.4</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="socialconditionsdata">Social Conditions</A></B>
<BR>One way to get a general idea of social structures within a country is to look at money spent on education, suicide rates, and divorce rates. In Table 3 below, details regarding that information can be found, which sheds some light on preparedness for the future, happiness, and monogamy within each country.
<P>
How a country views education tells us how its people value children and how its people plan for the future. It is a measure of how evolved its society is as well. The U.S. is fifth on the list even though it has the greatest GDP ($10 trillion, 2001) of all countries -- even of those that are not listed in Table 3. However, Saudi Arabia and Denmark's statistics are over 50% more than the U.S.'s value. Denmark allocates a huge percentage of their limited resources on education, telling us how much its people value education. It is possible that Denmark, along with other countries, have legalized prostitution as a result of the education they receive.
<P>
A measure of the overall citizen happiness may be obtained by looking at suicide rates for each country. The U.S. is third highest on the list and has over 50% more suicides per capita than Denmark. Only Greece and Mexico have higher rates, which may be a result caused by the low socio-economic conditions permeating those countries. Also, we see a trend occurring for countries that have legal prostitution; they have lower suicide rates, suggesting yet another benefit of industry regulation.
<P>
If we compare divorce rates between countries, we will understand the success of institutional monogamy under different social conditions. The United States is second highest, with eight times the divorces as Mexico, twice as many as Canada and 55% more than Denmark. It is clear that the U.S. has a high turnover rate. Meanwhile, most countries with legal prostitution have less of a problem with institutional monogamy.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=4><B><A NAME="socialtable">Table 3</A>: <I>Social Conditions</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>Spending on Education<BR>% of GDP</TD><TD>Suicide Rates<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Divorce Rates<BR>per 1000</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>4.0</TD><TD>2.5</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>7.7%</TD><TD>2.1</TD><TD>2.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>5.6%</TD><TD>2.8</TD><TD>0.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>2.3%</TD><TD>4.9</TD><TD>0.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>3.3%</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>6.9%</TD><TD>2.8</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>6.4</TD><TD>0.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>4.9%</TD><TD>2.0</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>7.2%</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>2.3%</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>4.7%</TD><TD>3.4</TD><TD>5.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>4.7%</TD><TD>4.5</TD><TD>5.0</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="summary">Summary</A></B>
<BR>Given the three broad categories above (<A HREF="#crimedata">Crime</A>, <A HREF="#healthcaredata">Healthcare</A>, <A HREF="#socialconditionsdata">Social conditions</A>), the countries having legal prostitution enjoy many benefits the United States does not. Crime is higher within the U.S., despite severe laws, intense prosecution rates and a high number of imprisonments. People infected with HIV/AIDS are higher, as is the number of HIV/AIDS deaths in the U.S. Even suicide rates and divorce rates are disproportionately high in the U.S., too.
<P>
Upon a close examination of the Netherlands reveals interesting findings. Amsterdam is the capitol of the Netherlands and is internationally known for its redlight district. Critics to prostitution might be stunned to learn that the Netherlands has the least number of murders and rapes. It prosecutes a considerable amount of criminals but has a low number of prisoners. It does not suffer from an HIV/AIDS epidemic, like the U.S. and the U.K., and has the second lowest suicide rate listed. This news will literally stop critics (who are open to reason) in their tracks when they are confronted with such information.
<P>
A scientific study may be able to prove a causal relationship between legalized, regulated prostitution and the benefits of lower crime, better healthcare, lower suicide rates and lower divorce rates. However, this positional paper shows beyond a doubt that legalization of prostitution certainly does not create an environment causing critical country indicators to wane. Therefore, there exists a strong probability of countering teenage prostitution and helping women leave prostitution through specially targeted social programs, all at no risk. It is likely there will be improvements for the nation as a whole, since all citizens are immeasurably tied to the larger community.
<P>
</OL>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="management">Management versus Abandonment</A></B>
<BR>The critics of legalized prostitution insist sex for money is wrong because it is harmful to prostitutes. They claim prostitutes are victims of physical abuse and frequently suffer from homelessness, alcoholism and dependency on other drugs. These critics report that prostitutes have often been sexually and/or physically abused while growing up.
<P>
What critics do not report is a plan to help these workers. Their rationale is a status quo model, which does absolutely nothing to help these women. Instead of managing the problem through the medical and social interventions accompanied by regulation of the industry, critics of legalized prostitution would rather adopt prohibition and cold abandonment.
<P>
When critics mention neighborhood safety, they do not offer meaningful alternatives. Their plan is to heighten police patrols, encourage undercover sting operations, and stiffen penalties. We have seen the results of prohibition in the 1920s [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above]; it drives the industry further underground, making it harder to stop the spread of HIV/AIDS (<A HREF="#McElroy">McElroy, 1999</A>) and various other sexually transmitted diseases in a community.
<P>
If critics of prostitution wanted to truly help prostitutes and the neighborhoods where prostitution occurs, they would reconsider their position. Prohibitionists retain their view as a result of moral codes, not because of unbiased scientific study. Research shows the many benefits of legalization. Allowing prohibitionist propaganda to drive laws and the way civil liberties are viewed will guarantee: drug dependency will not be abated, physical abuse will continue, and STDs will spread. Most important, the women who need help will continue their lives on the same harmful paths.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#prostitution">Prostitution as a Career</A></B>
<BR>Prostitution has been in existence for millennia, going back to the Byzantine, Roman, Greek, and Egyptian Empires. Ironically, the ancient religions of those eras dealt with the needs of the group and consequently developed protocols for dealing with sexual relations that have propagated throughout time to the modern era. As a result, prostitution is not about to disappear anytime soon, despite relatively recent local laws.
<P>
There are three strata of prostitutes. Within the top layer rests discrete call-girls for the affluent, much like the services Heidi Fleiss offered (<A HREF="#Copeland">Copeland, 1997</A>). The middle layer holds bordello-dwelling prostitutes or others in less subtle environments such as strip clubs and massage parlors that offer backroom services. Streetwalkers (harlots, hookers, nightwalkers, ...) occupy the lowest layer. Some people entertain a controversial notion that the role of wife is akin to being a prostitute (<A HREF="#Mechelen">Mechelen, 1992</A>); their placement within the strata may depend on what socio-economic class they reside once married.
<P>
The lowest layer prostitutes are plagued with the most problems. It is the group that usually remains perpetually vulnerable. They work in conditions that make them prone to violence due to a lack of supervision. And, there are healthcare risks due to unsafe sexual contact with unscreened clients.
<P>
These lower strata prostitutes are the women who require help. The others benefit from physically safe environments, decent to lucrative wages, and operate among clients that are more likely to be healthy. Lower strata prostitutes cannot afford decent medical services and are frequently physically assaulted by pimps or clients. These women are either lured into the industry by drugs or they turn to drugs as a means to cope with their hellish lives (<A HREF="#David">David, n.d.</A>). Most lower strata prostitutes exist within economically static careers. They contribute large portions of their revenue to pimps or drugs, making their condition inescapable.
<P>
Bottom strata prostitutes remain trapped, but the upper two-thirds are far less constrained. For the upper two strata of prostitutes, free will is present. They are able to carefully parlay their gains into real estate or financial investments even within localities having laws against prostitution. They can choose to leave prostitution for other careers or simply retire. Since it is impossible to stop prostitutes, the upper two-thirds will continue to make a fiscally respectful living from it and the lowest third will suffer.
<P>
If modern society rests itself on principles claiming to assist those who cannot help themselves and create structures where opportunities, not dead ends, are the norm, then these lower strata prostitutes do not deserve the abandonment from which they are suffering. Instead, politicians and community activists have become influenced by religious dogma and modern day Elmer Gantry's. The entities that long ago managed prostitution, like Swaggart, Bakker and even leaders of The Catholic Church (<A HREF="#Google">Google, 2003</A>), hypocritically exile prostitutes to lives they may identify as depraved; yet, they use their services, engage in adulterous relations and cover up widespread pedophilia. Prostitutes continue to suffer due to these long-standing traditions maintained in part by such religionists. No longer do these traditions serve humanity.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#conclusion">Conclusion</A></B>
<BR>Sexual relations are handled differently in countries around the world. Most countries encourage varied forms of monogamy, others polygyny. Even in the case of monogamy, there are numerous countries that impose no restrictions on prostitution, unlike a majority of the communities within the United States.
<P>
In order to discover if legalization is proper, one has to first familiarize oneself with the U.S. prohibition of alcohol in the 1920s and the legalization of abortion in the 1970s. The implementation of prohibition was a result of an abolitionist philosophy and caused great harm to the country through lost taxes, increased crime rates and higher suicide rates. Similarly, when the U.S. abandoned its abolitionist stand on abortion, the country benefited from fewer deaths from botched back alley abortions. This proved prohibitionist thinking to be baseless and actually detrimental to communities.
<P>
There are many benefits to legalized prostitution. The benefits include (1) allowing law enforcement agencies to respond to more important crimes, (2) freeing justice systems from nuisance cases, (3) helping women who are trapped by prostitution, and (4) preventing teens from being ensnared into prostitution.
<P>
When data from countries that ban prostitution is compared with data from countries that do not, many startling discoveries can be observed. Countries without anti-prostitution laws have less murders, less rapes, and prosecute/imprison less people. HIV/AIDS is less of a problem; suicide rates are lower as are divorce rates, too.
<P>
Critics of the legalization of prostitution offer no alternative to a troublesome problem. These people would rather adopt the status quo model, which virtually abandons lower strata, low socio-economic prostitutes. Instead of managing the problem, these critics view the continued downward spiral of this subgroup as acceptable.
<P>
The critics of legalized prostitution rest comfortably within relatively new moral codes. The religions that now reject prostitution once used to manage it. However, even though religionists publicly denounce prostitution, too many hypocritically entertain like services and commit adultery. The Catholic Church has covered up institutional pedophilia at the expense of demeaning religious values and the lives of those who aspire to follow them.
<P>
Enlightened people within civilized societies pride themselves on the contributions made to others who are less fortunate. Low strata prostitutes clearly rest within the domain of the less fortunate, but the countries who cling to anti-prostitution laws choose to abandon these people and thereby negatively affect the crime, health, and general safety of those nations. One must reconsider whether or not those countries are truly civilized.
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="Resources">Resources</A></B>
<BR>
<UL TYPE=square>
<LI><A NAME=Baldwin> </A>Baldwin, R. (2004) Classical Greece. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://socsci.gulfcoast.edu/rbaldwin/classical_greece.htm" TARGET="new">http://socsci.gulfcoast.edu/rbaldwin/classical_greece.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Casad> </A>Casad, A. (n.d.) The Sexual State of Human Nature. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.nd.edu/~acasad/papers/WARR_11B_2.pdf" TARGET="new">http://www.nd.edu/~acasad/papers/WARR_11B_2.pdf</A>
<LI><A NAME=Copeland> </A>Copeland, J. (1997) Heidi Fleiss Gets 3 Years. E! Online News. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,534,00.html" TARGET="new">http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,534,00.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=David> </A>David, S. (n.d.) The Specifities of Female Drug Addiction. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.drugtext.org/library/articles/peddr0033.htm" TARGET="new">http://www.drugtext.org/library/articles/peddr0033.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Decriminalize> </A>Decriminalize Prostitution Now Coalition (2000): What Countries Have Legal Prostitution? Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.sexwork.com/coalition/whatcountrieslegal.html" TARGET="new">http://www.sexwork.com/coalition/whatcountrieslegal.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Divorce> </A>Divorce Magazine (n.d.) U.S. Divorce Statistics. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml" TARGET="new">http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml</A>
<LI><A NAME=Gavin> </A>Gavin, K. (2001) News Release: Women need testing and care for infection that can steal fertility. University of Michigan Health System. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.med.umich.edu/opm/newspage/2001/chlam.htm" TARGET="new">http://www.med.umich.edu/opm/newspage/2001/chlam.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Google> </A>Google (2003) Search Engine. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://news.google.com/news?q=massage+parlor" TARGET="new">http://news.google.com/news?q=massage+parlor</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=catholic+church+pedophilia">http://www.google.com/search?q=catholic+church+pedophilia</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=swaggart+Debra+Murphree" TARGET="new">Jimmy Swaggart and Prostitute Debra Murphree</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=jim+bakker+jessica+hahn" TARGET="new">Jim Bakker and Church Secretary Jessica Hahn</A>
<LI><A NAME=Hughs> </A>Hughs, J. (1990) Monogamy as a Prisoners Dilemma: Non-Monogamy as a Collective Action Problem. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.changesurfer.com/Acad/Monogamy/Mono.html" TARGET="new">http://www.changesurfer.com/Acad/Monogamy/Mono.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Liberator> </A>The Liberator (2004) Official Website. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.liberator.net/" TARGET="_top">http://www.liberator.net/</A>
<LI>Malick, A. (n.d.) Humans Emit Sex Signals. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://preventdisease.com/news/articles/humans_emit_sex_signals.shtml" TARGET="new">http://preventdisease.com/news/articles/humans_emit_sex_signals.shtml</A>
<LI><A NAME=McElroy> </A>McElroy, W. (1999) Prostitution: Reconsidering Research. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://zetetics.com/mac/articles/spin1199.html" TARGET="new">http://zetetics.com/mac/articles/spin1199.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Mechelen> </A>Mechelen, R. (1992) Prostitution. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.backlash.com/book/prostit.html" TARGET="new">http://www.backlash.com/book/prostit.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Nation> </A>Nation Master (n.d.): Statistics Retriever. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.nationmaster.com/" TARGET="new">http://www.nationmaster.com/</A>
<LI><A NAME=Nixon> </A>Nixon, N. (2001) Bootlegging In Illinois: bathtub gin and the whole shootin' match. Illinois Periodicals Online (NIU). Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.lib.niu.edu/ipo/ic010410.html" TARGET="new">http://www.lib.niu.edu/ipo/ic010410.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Ohio> </A>Ohio State University (1997) The Brewing Industry and Prohibition. Temperance and Prohibition. Department of History. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://prohibition.osu.edu/Brewing/Default.htm" TARGET="new">http://prohibition.osu.edu/Brewing/Default.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Pines> </A>Pines, M. (n.d.) A Secret Sense in the Human Nose: Sniffing Out Social and Sexual Signals. The Howard Hughes Medical Institute. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.hhmi.org/senses/d210.html" TARGET="new">http://www.hhmi.org/senses/d210.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Planned> </A>Planned Parenthood (2002) Roe v. Wade: Its History and Impact. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/ABORTION/Roe.html" TARGET="new">http://www.plannedparenthood.org/library/ABORTION/Roe.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Schmid> </A>Schmid, Sanders, Blount & Alexander (1987) Chancroid in the United States. Reestablishment of an old disease. JAMA. Dec 11; 258(22): 3265-8.
<LI><A NAME=Steen> </A>Steen, R. (2001) Eradicating chancroid. Bulletin World Health Organization. 79(9): 818-826.
<LI><A NAME=Thornton> </A>Thornton, M (1991) Policy Analysis: Alcohol Prohibition Was A Failure. Auburn University (CATO Institute). Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-157.html" TARGET="new">http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa-157.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Walker> </A>Walker, N. (2002) Prostituted Teens: More than a Runaway Problem. Michigan Family Impact Seminars. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.icyf.msu.edu/publicats/briefng2/2002-2.pdf" TARGET="new">http://www.icyf.msu.edu/publicats/briefng2/2002-2.pdf</A>
<LI><A NAME=WCTU> </A>WCTU (n.d.) Official Site. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.wctu.org/" TARGET="new">http://www.wctu.org/</A>
</UL>
zarbizarre
2009-09-23, 04:17 AM
<OL TYPE=I>
<LI><A HREF="#introduction">Introduction</A>
<LI><A HREF="#cultural">Cultural Differences</A>
<LI><A HREF="#sex">Sex Within Monogamous Societies</A>
<LI><A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A>
<LI><A HREF="#benefits">Benefits of Legalization</A>
<LI><A HREF="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A>
<LI><A HREF="#role">The Role of Government</A>
<LI><A HREF="#comparing">Comparing Prostitution Rights to Abortion Rights</A>
<LI><A HREF="#religion">Religion Shapes the Economy Through the Family</A>
<LI><A HREF="#scientists">Scientists May Find Answers Through Research</A>
<LI><A HREF="#data">Data Driven Analysis</A>
<OL TYPE=A>
<LI><A HREF="#crimedata">Crime Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#healthcaredata">Healthcare Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#socialconditionsdata">Social Conditions Analysis</A>
<LI><A HREF="#summary">Summary</A>
</OL>
<LI><A HREF="#management">Management vs. Abandonment</A>
<LI><A HREF="#prostitution">Prostitution as a Career Choice</A>
<LI><A HREF="#conclusion">Conclusion</A>
<LI><A HREF="#resources">Resources</A>
<LI><A HREF="#related">Related Articles on The Liberator</A>
</OL>
<P><FONT SIZE=3 FACE="Arial">
<OL TYPE=I>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#introduction">Introduction</A></B>
<BR>With the invention of males and females came the constant need for negotiation, as history indicates. Some civilizations were based on male dominance and rewarded those who possessed strength, innate tactical intelligence and traits generally present in males. This explains why many civilizations have not been kind to women. A small number of civilizations did honor women, but women have never been able to achieve equal status with men.
<P>
Women have not always been able to escape the role of housewife or gain a political voice. Only in recent human history have women been able to obtain relative equality. They have been able to make great gains through a considerable amount of achievements, no need to list here. Yet to this day, men and women have specialized roles within societies, differing only slightly in some countries and greatly in other countries.
<P>
[<A HREF="#top">Return to top.</A>]
<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#cultural">Cultural Differences</A></B>
<BR>Each culture deals differently with heterosexuality. Most cultures encourage monogamy, while countries like Saudi Arabia have adopted polygyny. Even within societies that safeguard or promote monogamous relations, there are allowances for citizens to have many types of sexual relations. People can remain monogamous to one person at time or date multiple partners simultaneously. People can have open marriages (a.k.a. swinging) or exist within monogamous relationships and be covertly promiscuous (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>). There are also people who frequent prostitutes regardless of the law.
<P>
<TABLE ALIGN=right BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=3><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR><TR><TD ALIGN=left WIDTH=280><FONT COLOR=red FACE="Times" SIZE=5><B>“Instead of managing the problem through the medical and social interventions accompanied by regulation of the industry, critics of legalized prostitution would rather adopt prohibition and cold abandonment.”</B></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR></TABLE>
When we examine sex as a trade, the combination of philosophy, cultural precedence, religious influence and politics made each country select how to handle it in its own way. In Singapore, sex for money is open and commonplace. Denmark women can be legal prostitutes so long as it is not their sole means of income. Canada, France and Mexico allow it. Prostitutes must be contained within brothels in the Netherlands, unlike within England and Wales where prostitution is limited to individual providers. Israel, the historical stage for the Bible, allows it, too. Meanwhile, the United States has made prostitution illegal (misdemeanor) in all states, except certain counties of Nevada (<A HREF="#Decriminalize">Decriminalize Prostitution Now Coalition, 2000</A>).
<P>
Even though it is quite natural on a biological level for males and females to host desires and have intimate relations with many partners (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>), it would probably be a very unproductive line of reasoning when considering the legalization of prostitution. Humankind no longer succumbs to animal behavior and has built infrastructures that depend on us expunging primitive mannerisms. Unlike the animal kingdom, we deal with sexuality without force. Nevertheless, there is still room for prostitution within civilized societies, since sex can be considered to be a service traded for goods, services, relationships, and money.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#sex">Sex Within Monogamous Societies</A></B>
<BR>Sex sometimes becomes a bartered service even within the sanctity of marriage. One provides sex for love, while another provides love for sex. Someone else finds warmth and attention within the act of sex. Like ants who send chemical messages to each other to convey both intricate and basic messages, sex becomes part of that type of communication even within civilized relationships (<A HREF="Pines">Pines, n.d.</A> & <A HREF="#Malick">Malick, n.d.</A>). It is also a healthy outlet, too. We may not be animals who forage in forests but our desire for sex, or at least the actions, thoughts and feelings that come with it, are deeply part of whom we are.
<P>
A primal desire must not be ignored or suppressed, but instead managed. Within the sanctity of marriage, balancing acts must be performed to ensure each member of the team is getting what he or she needs. From cleaning the house, buying new furniture, displaying one's affection and releasing stress, sex gets caught up in the mix and can sometimes become a bargaining chip. It is as normal as doing a favor or performing an act of kindness, when one is not in the mood. Much like when a chore must be done, one may choose or not choose to do it, depending on extenuating circumstances or immediate pressing demands.
<P>
Sex, like everything else, is up on the table for 'sale' within marriage and other relationships. It is not a foreign concept to anyone who has ever been in a sexual relationship over an extended period of time. Usually there is no direct exchange of money, but natural exchanges in a give-and-take situation do occur when things are normal and healthy. So long as there are no heavy demands and freedom of choice exists, sex is a commodity of sorts.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A></B>
<BR>The United States is rooted on freedom of speech, religion and trade. The first two are specifically mentioned early on within The Constitution. Those inalienable rights are not given to us by The Constitution, but are instead protected by it. So why violate the premise by prohibiting relations between consenting adults?
<P>
Some people believe that governments can make better choices for us, but it wasn't a vision the Founding Fathers had when they created The Constitution. The U.S. government is designed mainly to be run by the people, which is in direct opposition to modern liberalism that insists it control people. Yet, morally conservative groups that adopted this liberal view of government passed the Eighteenth Amendment to prohibit the distribution and sale of alcohol.
<P>
Recall prohibition from 1920 to 1933 and remember the affects it had on alcohol consumption. Home producers created whiskey and bathtub gin. The price of alcohol skyrocketed in black market sales due to heavy demand and the greedy public officials who secretly monitored it, so it was believed. Bootlegging became an underground industry (<A HREF="#Nixon">Nixon, 2001</A>). As a result prohibition did literally nothing to actually prevent alcohol from being consumed by the public.
<P>
The government, and ultimately the public, suffered huge losses from prohibition. The government lost considerable amounts of tax dollars from bootlegged alcohol and it became impossible to regulate the quality, i.e. safety, of the product. In attempts to prohibit alcohol consumption through the Volstead Act, spending by the Bureau of Prohibition went from $4.4 million to $13.4 million annually. Spending by the Coast Guard was an average $13 million per year in the 1920s for prohibition alone (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>). In fact when per capita costs are analyzed, spending more to curb behavior did literally nothing against consumption, making a total mockery of law enforcement efforts.
<P>
Social irresponsibility of this magnitude during the depression was horrific when considering how these monies could have been spent to do good for society. Programs could have been developed to help the unemployed. Healthcare could have been expanded to include social programs to drive down high suicide rates.
<P>
It was thought prohibition would put an end to many social problems but it actually created many more. Increasing the number of laws runs a risk of creating more criminals, and that is exactly what had happened. Jails became filled. Government spending to pay for the housing and maintenance of these criminals went up (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>). Compounded by the lack of intake from alcohol tax, it placed huge dents on public coffers.
<P>
Prohibition caused many problems related to criminal activity. There was a causal link between prohibition and an increase in homicides. During prohibition, homicide rates increased over 66%. After prohibition was repealed on Dec. 5, 1933, the homicide rate immediately dropped and eventually reached pre-prohibition levels in the mid-1940s (<A HREF="#Thornton">Thornton, 1991</A>).
<P>
The philosophy of prohibition came from many 'dry groups,' but the Anti-Saloon League working closely with the Woman's Christian Temperance Union were the driving forces in establishing prohibition (<A HREF="#Ohio">Ohio State University, 1997</A>). Politics, which is really about solving the problems society faces, became victimized by morally conservative lobbyists. They held a belief that a desire for spirits could be repressed instead of managed. We will see over the course of human history that the philosophy of repression and abolition bears no merit.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#benefits">Benefits of Legalization</A></B>
<BR>Currently most everywhere in the United States, our legal system penalizes prostitutes and their customers for what they do as consenting adults. Money is still spent on law enforcement efforts to catch prostitutes and their customers. Once caught, justice departments have to process these people through very expensive systems.
<P>
What are the end results? Police personnel and courtrooms are overburdened with these cases, having little or no impact on prostitution. The prostitutes and their customers pay their fines and are back to the streets in no time in a revolving door process. Catch and release may work for recreational fishing but it has no deterring affect on prostitution.
<P>
Making prostitution legal will allow the act to be managed instead of ignored. Pimps and organized crime figures, who regularly treat their workers on subhuman levels, would no longer control women. In some countries, prostitute rings buy and sell women on the black market, force their women to comply through violence and create unhealthy working conditions. When prostitutes operate independently and in secret, many times they become abused by their own customers.
<P>
Legalizing prostitution would prevent underground prostitution that occurs today. When men want to pay for sex, they find prostitutes. These people work in massage parlors, escort services, strip bars and modeling agencies or still work corners as traditional streetwalkers. There are legitimate parlors, dating services, bars and agencies but of the hundreds that exist within newspaper classified advertisements and telephone directories, there are a large number that provide sexual services. A routine search through Google's Internet news engine for 'prostitution' routinely reveals connections between prostitution and these falsetto agencies (<A HREF="#Google">Google, 2004</A>).
<P>
It is estimated that 100,000 to 3 million teens are nearly invisibly prostituted per year in the United States (<A HREF="#Walker">Walker, 2002</A>). If we allow prostitution to remain hidden from view and basically invisible to the law as it is today, we allow a number of teens to be swept up into prostitution every year. When adult women decide to exchange money for sex, it is a personal choice open to them under the philosophy of a free, democratic society. When troubled minors who do not yet have the social survival skills decide to prostitute, they are often manipulated by opportunists who exploit these teens, typically leading to horrific ends. Legalizing prostitution will help prevent these instances through regulation.
<P>
Legalized, regulated prostitution has many benefits. Encounters can happen within controlled environments that bring about safety for both the customers and the prostitutes. Prostitutes would no longer be strong-armed by pimps or organized crime rings. Underage prostitution would be curtailed. There would also be health-safety improvements.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A></B>
<BR>The status quo is a poor health-safety plan. With sexually transmitted diseases (STDs) like syphilis, gonorrhea, chlamydia and herpes, prostitutes must be monitored to prevent the spread of these afflictions. Chancroid, a STD typically found in third world nations, is occurring in places throughout the U.S. due to transmission brought on through illegal prostitution (<A HREF="#Schmid">Schmid, Sanders, Blount & Alexander, 1987</A>). Chancroid makes ulcers in the vagina that assist with the spread of HIV/AIDS.
<P>
A Public Health Review of Chancroid from the World Health Organization stated:
<BLOCKQUOTE><FONT FACE="Times">
In Kenya, where the importance of chancroid in HIV transmission was first described in the late 1980s, interventions targeting sex workers and STD patients were implemented. Reported condom use by sex workers has since increased to over 80% in project areas and the incidence of genital ulcers has declined. Chancroid, once the most common ulcer etiology, now accounts for fewer than 10% of genital ulcers seen in clinics in Nairobi, Kenya.
<P>
In Senegal, HIV prevalence among pregnant women has been below 1% for more than a decade. A strong multisectoral response, an effective STD control programme and early legalization of prostitution have been credited for this low level. Special clinical services, for example, offer regular examination and treatment for registered sex workers. Not only has there been a significant decline in STD rates among sex workers and pregnant women between 1991 and 1996, but genital ulcers are also no longer common and chancroid is reportedly rare.
</FONT>(<A HREF="#Steen">Steen, 2001</A>)</BLOCKQUOTE>
Steen cited a practical example of how government can help its citizens. It makes practical sense to monitor prostitution and what better way is there to monitor it than by legalizing it and regulating it? Legalization would require prostitutes to undergo regular medical examinations. STDs would be prevented from being spread as well as other communicable ailments like hepatitis and tuberculosis. It would also reduce gender violence, allow women to escape prostitution, if they so choose, and prevent women from becoming infertile as a consequence to obtaining certain STDs (<A HREF="#Gavin">Gavin, 2001</A>).
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#role">The Role of Government</A></B>
<BR>Whether one is a liberal or conservative, republican or democrat, the role of government is to carry out necessary duties its citizens cannot perform. Politicians are elected to government positions to solve the problems countries face. Some Democratic politicians insist government should be designed to act as a safety net for people who need help, by providing citizens with various social programs including public safety and healthcare entitlements. Other Republican representatives believe in freedom of choice through responsible action and rather institute high standards in education and healthcare to enable citizens with opportunities. Libertarians feel compelled to ensure civil rights and allow citizens to be self-governing members of society.
<P>
In these cases, the issue of morality aside, it can be plainly seen how each political view contains strong elements supporting legalization. Maintaining the status quo has the U.S. throwing tax dollars away by spending it on law enforcement, criminal justice and prisons. The U.S. healthcare system is currently reactionary at best; it passively handles STDs after they occur instead of instituting mechanisms to prevent them from happening in the first place. Political philosophy has not changed from immaturity and clings to a prohibitory model from the 1920s, even though it was proven to be devastating to its citizens [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above].
<P>
The best way to understand the current state of affairs concerning prostitution is to entertain an analogy. Pretend government is a business. Politicians would be the managers and prostitution would be a certain procedure the company had to manage. Would a successful business ignore a procedure when it performed poorly? Would it allow a poor procedure to continue or would a successful business instead rethink its position and improve it? All successful companies must evolve over time if they are to stay in business and excel. Fortunately, the U.S. Constitution allows its citizens to view government like a dynamic business because it is a work in progress. Laws can change and adapt to meet the demands of a modern civilization. It is a far better strategy than hoping it will go away and clean up itself.
<P>
Where are the limits for two consenting adults in privacy? How government is shaped to handle that question will decide how women's rights, social programs, public healthcare, the safety of youth and possibly the general safety of citizens are valued. If moral obstacles prevent citizens from obtaining a government that helps its people while preserving freedoms, then a paradigm shift must be considered. A movement away from values that are harmful is difficult only if one decides to cling to outdated, self-destructive traditions.
<P>
Politicians should be careful how they address the philosophical limits of adult privacy. A number of people believe government should have no right deciding how adults conduct their sexual lives, even when an exchange of money is involved. Public debate has already addressed a women's rights issue that is connected to a similar freedom.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#comparing">Comparing Prostitution Rights to Abortion Rights</A></B>
<BR>Abortion was decided to be legal by The Supreme Court in 1973 in a landmark case: Roe vs. Wade. Intellectuals have weighed the issue and decided in favor for women's rights in part due to public safety.
<P>
<TABLE ALIGN=right BORDER=0 CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=3><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR><TR><TD ALIGN=left WIDTH=280><FONT COLOR=red FACE="Times" SIZE=5><B>“If modern society rests itself on principles claiming to assist those who cannot help themselves and create structures where opportunities, not dead ends, are the norm, then these lower strata prostitutes do not deserve the abandonment from which they are suffering.”</B></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR COLOR=#a0a0a0 SIZE=2 WIDTH=90%></TD></TR></TABLE>
Considering the safety gains, the decision was proper, despite perpetual moral objections from religious groups ignoring longstanding facts to this day. Pre-1973, 17% of all deaths due to pregnancy and childbirth were the result of illegal abortions. Pre-1973, 1.2 million women resorted to illegal abortions yearly and botched illegal abortions caused as many as 5,000 deaths a year. Untrained physician in unsanitary conditions using primitive methods often performed illegal abortions (<A HREF="#Planned">Planned Parenthood, 2002</A>).
<P>
As with the treatment of alcohol in the '20s, prohibiting abortions did not stop them. In fact, illegal abortions were commonplace and hazardous to the health of women. Again we see the outcome of a prohibitory philosophy [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above]. The facts indicate we must abandon abolitionist thinking and insist society rest on what is best for it. Traditionalists would disagree, but what evidence do they use to support their opinion?
<P>
The Christian group partly responsible for prohibition in the '20s now takes an interesting view concerning abolition. The Women's Christian Temperance Union states on its official website "Temperance may be defined as: moderation in all things healthful; total abstinence from all things harmful" (<A HREF="#WCTU">Women's Christian Temperance Union, n.d.</A>). Originating from a religious group that played a part in the prohibition disaster, it appears to have undergone a paradigm shift.
<P>
The quote is an interesting one, coming from an organization having ties to values generally thought to be moral. Certain religious groups insist society not be corrupted by negative behaviors and consequently ban them. This group must now see the futility of such a position, which brings us hope for other morally centered organizations. Regardless, the quote was from the insightful Greek philosopher Xenophon (400 B.C.), who lived in a time when prostitution was legal and often performed within temples (<A HREF="#Baldwin">Baldwin, 2004</A>).
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#religion">Religion Shapes the Economy Through the Family</A></B>
<BR>Either by observing nature, tackling the problems of humankind or listening to persons claiming divine inspiration, religionists proclaim they know what is good for us. Consequently, they seek to shape society. Sometimes they shape society through dogma or lobby politicians to pass ordinances and laws. Their strength comes from an ability to mobilize groups and form organizations.
<P>
It was probably thought pairing men and women while punishing those who stray from monogamy was a way of keeping people productive. Purpose does tend to fall to the wayside when people are constantly at odds due to promiscuity. Families on the other hand promote other families and the dependence on those families creates stabilization.
<P>
When societies are stable, religionists may argue, greater deeds are possible to accomplish. We invent tools, find medical cures and create works of art that elevate the human spirit. It enables humankind to manufacture materials, offer services and develop trade locally or abroad. Monogamy, it is seen, gave birth to the present-day economy.
<P>
Religionists, economists and successful philanthropists want to preserve the status quo model. 'Why change a good thing?' would be their argument. To that, one would have to point to the futility of prohibitionist philosophies. Alcohol consumption of the 1920s along with present-day indicators (like homicide rates, divorce rates and continued women's rights issues) might tell us a different story. Is a desire for a steady-state economy at the expense of citizens a good long-range plan?
<P>
Maybe the entire economy depends on the family, or does it? In a capitalistic country, like The United States, the economy is tied mainly to the goods it sells. The more consumers and the more they purchase, the better off the country is as a whole. Having and promoting families is a way of continuing the steady-state economy.
<P>
However, the only guarantee from this attachment to a steady-state model is the production of children, not the production of families. Let the statistics of marriage speak for themselves. The average length of a marriage is 7.2 years. 50% of marriages fail, while 60% of remarriages fail. Roughly 1 million children per year become directly affected by divorce (<A HREF="#Divorce Magazine">Divorce Magazine, n.d.</A>). It is clear too many marriages end poorly for a high number of children in the United States, making the mainstream religionist's premise within the U.S. faulty.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#scientists">Scientists May Find Answers Through Research</A></B>
<BR>
There are bigger questions here that go beyond the scope of this investigation into legalized prostitution. Is the pursuit of the elusive family dependant upon having children? When many marriages fail, what value is there to families? What are the societal consequences of producing so many children without the structure of two-parent homes? There appears to be a need for change of the way religionists and society handles monogamy, marriage, and the family in the not so distant future.
<P>
Population scientists agree there are already many concerns related to having too many people. The very model that sustains a modern capitalistic country -- goods combined with an increasing consumer base -- is having a detrimental impact on ecological levels. Pollution of air, water, land and sound is already evident and is no longer mere theory.
<P>
Humans, unlike successful species, never left a colonization mode, which needs to be altered. Producing large quantities of offspring is necessary only when natural conditions, like numerous predators or inhospitable environments, prevent young from producing offspring of their own. This is no longer the case. Now, human survival may already depend on decreased growth or zero population growth. Moves toward that goal would require a different worldview with different mores.
<P>
One social dynamic to consider is serial monogamy. When people are left to naturally gravitate toward relationships without strong economic, moral, or legal forces, serial monogamy is often chosen and the lifelong monogamous relationship ideal is abandoned. There is even biological and psychological justification to defend this practice (<A HREF="#Casad">Casad, n.d.</A>).
<P>
Other social dynamics to consider are of a non-monogamous nature. Only 2% of all species are monogamous. Chimpanzees, the closest relative to the human species, practice "group marriages". With socio-biological urges guiding humans toward sexual diversity, maintaining monogamy as the social norm can be viewed as peculiar at best (<A HREF="#Hughs">Hughs, 1990</A>). It certainly explains divorce rates and the problem of promiscuity in countries holding monogamy to unwarranted high regard.
<P>
Yet if the current, haphazard child production model is abandoned, where will social scientists look for a replacement model? Globalization may have them looking at other countries to see what works and what does not work while still preserving women's rights and maintaining high healthcare standards and other important social factors.
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#data">Data Driven Analysis</A></B>
<BR>If society must accurately decide whether regulated prostitution is better than illegal prostitution, then scientists must analyze the wealth of information that exists. Social scientists and common voting citizens must look at data from countries having legal prostitution and compare them to The United States. Canada, the Netherlands, Mexico, and France have legal forms of prostitution as does Israel, Greece, Denmark, Singapore and the United Kingdom. Saudi Arabia allows polygyny and Iran offers "temporary wives". Examining these countries in the broad areas of crime, healthcare, and social conditions will help determine if prostitution should be legalized.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=0>
<TR><TD VALIGN=top><FONT FACE="Times">Note: </FONT></TD><TD><FONT FACE="Times">All statistics, save for two, are per capita. One statistic indicates government spending on education as a percent of gross domestic product. The other is a mean age for life expectancy. Standardizing these values with the use of rates (indicator per 1000 members), percents, and means allows one to compare these countries without a need to introduce differences in population. Entries of "X" indicate values that were either unreported by respective governments or were unavailable by statistics agencies used by Nation Master (<A HREF="#Nation">n.d.</A>).</FONT></TD></TR></TABLE>
<P>
<OL TYPE=A>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="crimedata">Crime</A></B>
<BR>Crime is a word used to describe taboo behaviors in a society. Each society defines it and enacts punishments to counter it differently. In Table 1 below, we will find comparative statistics on serious crimes and information on how criminals are pursued. Murders, rapes, the number of adults prosecuted, and number of prisoners per country are listed.
<P>
Serious crimes are high in the United States. The U.S. places second on the murder list. The only country with a higher rate is Mexico. The U.S. has nearly half the murders as Mexico, but has two and a half times as many murders as Canada. When looking at rape data, the U.S. is second on the list, with Canada topping it. The U.S. rate is slightly less than half of Canada's rate, but more than double France's rate. The United States sits firmly in second place with these two violent crimes.
<P>
The United States has problems with violent crime despite great efforts to prosecute criminals and imprison them. The U.S. prosecutes almost five times the number of people as Canada and over eight times the number that Mexico reports. The U.S. is also unrivaled in terms of imprisonment. France comes the closest to the U.S.'s number of inmates, confining one-sixth the number as the U.S.
<P>
It is unknown if there is a correlation between laws that prohibit sex and higher crime rates, but the reverse appears to be more enlightening. The countries where prostitution is legal do not suffer from a high number of violent crimes. It appears legalized prostitution does not make societies more of a crime hazard. Contrary to the prohibitionist's philosophy, this data may give reason to implement and regulate prostitution to reduce crime because crime in countries where prostitution is legal is lower than the U.S.'s rates.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=5><B><A NAME="crimetable">Table 1</A>: <I>Crime</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>Murders<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Rapes<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Adults<BR>Prosecuted<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Prisoners<BR>per 1000</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>0.02</TD><TD>0.75</TD><TD>11.8</TD><TD>1.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.09</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>0.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>0.02</TD><TD>0.14</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>0.13</TD><TD>0.13</TD><TD>0.6</TD><TD>1.5</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.1</TD><TD>11.0</TD><TD>0.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>0.14</TD><TD>25.2</TD><TD>1.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>0.32</TD><TD>50.6</TD><TD>6.4</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="healthcaredata">Healthcare</A></B>
<BR>We recognize the general level of compassion and technological ability of a country in part by its ability to provide healthcare to its citizens. Laws, societal trends, and healthcare distribution also determine how a country will react to these variables. In Table 2 below, we will find data on HIV/AIDS rates and life expectancy levels for various countries.
<P>
The United States is tied at first place with the U.K. when it comes to the number of people per capita who live with HIV/AIDS. In Israel, where prostitution is legal, they suffer from nearly an eighth of the U.S.'s number. The U.K. aside, legal prostitution does not appear to have a negative impact on the spread of HIV/AIDS. In fact, there is evidence [see <A HREF="#health">Health-Safety Issues</A> above] to support the positive effects of legalizing prostitution on the spread of HIV/AIDS.
<P>
The U.S. is number one on the list for number of people dying of HIV/AIDS. There are many reasons to explain this fact even though the U.K. has an equal number of people infected with HIV/AIDS living in the country, but none of those reasons have to do with the legalization of prostitution. It may be a bit perplexing to prohibitionists when a country with legalized prostitution, like Canada, has a seventh of the number of HIV/AIDS infections as the U.S.
<P>
When looking at mean life expectancy by country, the result is less than special. There appears to be no causal relation between life expectancy and prostitution laws. However, the six countries that have higher life expectancies do have legal forms of prostitution, making it clear that prostitution does not negatively affect longevity.
<P>
There is a strong rationale for legalizing prostitution by regulating the industry, thereby monitoring sex workers and consequently the clients they serve. Allowing prostitution to remain invisible only perpetuates the spread of sometimes-deadly sexually transmitted diseases. A containment model based on managing the problem is better than an abolitionist model based on ignoring it, hoping it one day goes away all by itself.
<P>
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=4><B><A NAME="healthcaretable">Table 2</A>: <I>Healthcare</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>People Living<BR>with HIV/AIDS<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>HIV/AIDS Deaths<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Mean Life<BR>Expectancy</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>79.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>0.8</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>76.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>2.2</TD><TD>0.03</TD><TD>79.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>0.8</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>78.7</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>70.3</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>0.4</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>78.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>72.0</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>78.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>0</TD><TD>68.4</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>0.9</TD><TD>0.05</TD><TD>80.3</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>3.0</TD><TD>0.01</TD><TD>78.0</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>3.0</TD><TD>0.07</TD><TD>77.4</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="socialconditionsdata">Social Conditions</A></B>
<BR>One way to get a general idea of social structures within a country is to look at money spent on education, suicide rates, and divorce rates. In Table 3 below, details regarding that information can be found, which sheds some light on preparedness for the future, happiness, and monogamy within each country.
<P>
How a country views education tells us how its people value children and how its people plan for the future. It is a measure of how evolved its society is as well. The U.S. is fifth on the list even though it has the greatest GDP ($10 trillion, 2001) of all countries -- even of those that are not listed in Table 3. However, Saudi Arabia and Denmark's statistics are over 50% more than the U.S.'s value. Denmark allocates a huge percentage of their limited resources on education, telling us how much its people value education. It is possible that Denmark, along with other countries, have legalized prostitution as a result of the education they receive.
<P>
A measure of the overall citizen happiness may be obtained by looking at suicide rates for each country. The U.S. is third highest on the list and has over 50% more suicides per capita than Denmark. Only Greece and Mexico have higher rates, which may be a result caused by the low socio-economic conditions permeating those countries. Also, we see a trend occurring for countries that have legal prostitution; they have lower suicide rates, suggesting yet another benefit of industry regulation.
<P>
If we compare divorce rates between countries, we will understand the success of institutional monogamy under different social conditions. The United States is second highest, with eight times the divorces as Mexico, twice as many as Canada and 55% more than Denmark. It is clear that the U.S. has a high turnover rate. Meanwhile, most countries with legal prostitution have less of a problem with institutional monogamy.
<P>
<TABLE BORDER=1 WIDTH=80%>
<TR ALIGN=center><TD COLSPAN=4><B><A NAME="socialtable">Table 3</A>: <I>Social Conditions</I></B></TD></TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD> </TD><TD>Spending on Education<BR>% of GDP</TD><TD>Suicide Rates<BR>per 1000</TD><TD>Divorce Rates<BR>per 1000</TD>
</TD>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Canada</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>4.0</TD><TD>2.5</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Denmark</TD><TD>7.7%</TD><TD>2.1</TD><TD>2.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>France</TD><TD>5.6%</TD><TD>2.8</TD><TD>0.9</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Greece</TD><TD>2.3%</TD><TD>4.9</TD><TD>0.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Iran</TD><TD>3.3%</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Israel</TD><TD>6.9%</TD><TD>2.8</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Mexico</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>6.4</TD><TD>0.6</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Netherlands</TD><TD>4.9%</TD><TD>2.0</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Saudi Arabia</TD><TD>7.2%</TD><TD>X</TD><TD>X</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>Singapore</TD><TD>2.3%</TD><TD>1.5</TD><TD>0.8</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United Kingdom</TD><TD>4.7%</TD><TD>3.4</TD><TD>5.1</TD>
</TR>
<TR ALIGN=center>
<TD>United States</TD><TD>4.7%</TD><TD>4.5</TD><TD>5.0</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="summary">Summary</A></B>
<BR>Given the three broad categories above (<A HREF="#crimedata">Crime</A>, <A HREF="#healthcaredata">Healthcare</A>, <A HREF="#socialconditionsdata">Social conditions</A>), the countries having legal prostitution enjoy many benefits the United States does not. Crime is higher within the U.S., despite severe laws, intense prosecution rates and a high number of imprisonments. People infected with HIV/AIDS are higher, as is the number of HIV/AIDS deaths in the U.S. Even suicide rates and divorce rates are disproportionately high in the U.S., too.
<P>
Upon a close examination of the Netherlands reveals interesting findings. Amsterdam is the capitol of the Netherlands and is internationally known for its redlight district. Critics to prostitution might be stunned to learn that the Netherlands has the least number of murders and rapes. It prosecutes a considerable amount of criminals but has a low number of prisoners. It does not suffer from an HIV/AIDS epidemic, like the U.S. and the U.K., and has the second lowest suicide rate listed. This news will literally stop critics (who are open to reason) in their tracks when they are confronted with such information.
<P>
A scientific study may be able to prove a causal relationship between legalized, regulated prostitution and the benefits of lower crime, better healthcare, lower suicide rates and lower divorce rates. However, this positional paper shows beyond a doubt that legalization of prostitution certainly does not create an environment causing critical country indicators to wane. Therefore, there exists a strong probability of countering teenage prostitution and helping women leave prostitution through specially targeted social programs, all at no risk. It is likely there will be improvements for the nation as a whole, since all citizens are immeasurably tied to the larger community.
<P>
</OL>
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<LI>
<B><A NAME="management">Management versus Abandonment</A></B>
<BR>The critics of legalized prostitution insist sex for money is wrong because it is harmful to prostitutes. They claim prostitutes are victims of physical abuse and frequently suffer from homelessness, alcoholism and dependency on other drugs. These critics report that prostitutes have often been sexually and/or physically abused while growing up.
<P>
What critics do not report is a plan to help these workers. Their rationale is a status quo model, which does absolutely nothing to help these women. Instead of managing the problem through the medical and social interventions accompanied by regulation of the industry, critics of legalized prostitution would rather adopt prohibition and cold abandonment.
<P>
When critics mention neighborhood safety, they do not offer meaningful alternatives. Their plan is to heighten police patrols, encourage undercover sting operations, and stiffen penalties. We have seen the results of prohibition in the 1920s [see <A HREF="#effects">The Effects of Prohibition</A> above]; it drives the industry further underground, making it harder to stop the spread of HIV/AIDS (<A HREF="#McElroy">McElroy, 1999</A>) and various other sexually transmitted diseases in a community.
<P>
If critics of prostitution wanted to truly help prostitutes and the neighborhoods where prostitution occurs, they would reconsider their position. Prohibitionists retain their view as a result of moral codes, not because of unbiased scientific study. Research shows the many benefits of legalization. Allowing prohibitionist propaganda to drive laws and the way civil liberties are viewed will guarantee: drug dependency will not be abated, physical abuse will continue, and STDs will spread. Most important, the women who need help will continue their lives on the same harmful paths.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#prostitution">Prostitution as a Career</A></B>
<BR>Prostitution has been in existence for millennia, going back to the Byzantine, Roman, Greek, and Egyptian Empires. Ironically, the ancient religions of those eras dealt with the needs of the group and consequently developed protocols for dealing with sexual relations that have propagated throughout time to the modern era. As a result, prostitution is not about to disappear anytime soon, despite relatively recent local laws.
<P>
There are three strata of prostitutes. Within the top layer rests discrete call-girls for the affluent, much like the services Heidi Fleiss offered (<A HREF="#Copeland">Copeland, 1997</A>). The middle layer holds bordello-dwelling prostitutes or others in less subtle environments such as strip clubs and massage parlors that offer backroom services. Streetwalkers (harlots, hookers, nightwalkers, ...) occupy the lowest layer. Some people entertain a controversial notion that the role of wife is akin to being a prostitute (<A HREF="#Mechelen">Mechelen, 1992</A>); their placement within the strata may depend on what socio-economic class they reside once married.
<P>
The lowest layer prostitutes are plagued with the most problems. It is the group that usually remains perpetually vulnerable. They work in conditions that make them prone to violence due to a lack of supervision. And, there are healthcare risks due to unsafe sexual contact with unscreened clients.
<P>
These lower strata prostitutes are the women who require help. The others benefit from physically safe environments, decent to lucrative wages, and operate among clients that are more likely to be healthy. Lower strata prostitutes cannot afford decent medical services and are frequently physically assaulted by pimps or clients. These women are either lured into the industry by drugs or they turn to drugs as a means to cope with their hellish lives (<A HREF="#David">David, n.d.</A>). Most lower strata prostitutes exist within economically static careers. They contribute large portions of their revenue to pimps or drugs, making their condition inescapable.
<P>
Bottom strata prostitutes remain trapped, but the upper two-thirds are far less constrained. For the upper two strata of prostitutes, free will is present. They are able to carefully parlay their gains into real estate or financial investments even within localities having laws against prostitution. They can choose to leave prostitution for other careers or simply retire. Since it is impossible to stop prostitutes, the upper two-thirds will continue to make a fiscally respectful living from it and the lowest third will suffer.
<P>
If modern society rests itself on principles claiming to assist those who cannot help themselves and create structures where opportunities, not dead ends, are the norm, then these lower strata prostitutes do not deserve the abandonment from which they are suffering. Instead, politicians and community activists have become influenced by religious dogma and modern day Elmer Gantry's. The entities that long ago managed prostitution, like Swaggart, Bakker and even leaders of The Catholic Church (<A HREF="#Google">Google, 2003</A>), hypocritically exile prostitutes to lives they may identify as depraved; yet, they use their services, engage in adulterous relations and cover up widespread pedophilia. Prostitutes continue to suffer due to these long-standing traditions maintained in part by such religionists. No longer do these traditions serve humanity.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="#conclusion">Conclusion</A></B>
<BR>Sexual relations are handled differently in countries around the world. Most countries encourage varied forms of monogamy, others polygyny. Even in the case of monogamy, there are numerous countries that impose no restrictions on prostitution, unlike a majority of the communities within the United States.
<P>
In order to discover if legalization is proper, one has to first familiarize oneself with the U.S. prohibition of alcohol in the 1920s and the legalization of abortion in the 1970s. The implementation of prohibition was a result of an abolitionist philosophy and caused great harm to the country through lost taxes, increased crime rates and higher suicide rates. Similarly, when the U.S. abandoned its abolitionist stand on abortion, the country benefited from fewer deaths from botched back alley abortions. This proved prohibitionist thinking to be baseless and actually detrimental to communities.
<P>
There are many benefits to legalized prostitution. The benefits include (1) allowing law enforcement agencies to respond to more important crimes, (2) freeing justice systems from nuisance cases, (3) helping women who are trapped by prostitution, and (4) preventing teens from being ensnared into prostitution.
<P>
When data from countries that ban prostitution is compared with data from countries that do not, many startling discoveries can be observed. Countries without anti-prostitution laws have less murders, less rapes, and prosecute/imprison less people. HIV/AIDS is less of a problem; suicide rates are lower as are divorce rates, too.
<P>
Critics of the legalization of prostitution offer no alternative to a troublesome problem. These people would rather adopt the status quo model, which virtually abandons lower strata, low socio-economic prostitutes. Instead of managing the problem, these critics view the continued downward spiral of this subgroup as acceptable.
<P>
The critics of legalized prostitution rest comfortably within relatively new moral codes. The religions that now reject prostitution once used to manage it. However, even though religionists publicly denounce prostitution, too many hypocritically entertain like services and commit adultery. The Catholic Church has covered up institutional pedophilia at the expense of demeaning religious values and the lives of those who aspire to follow them.
<P>
Enlightened people within civilized societies pride themselves on the contributions made to others who are less fortunate. Low strata prostitutes clearly rest within the domain of the less fortunate, but the countries who cling to anti-prostitution laws choose to abandon these people and thereby negatively affect the crime, health, and general safety of those nations. One must reconsider whether or not those countries are truly civilized.
<P>
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<P>
<LI>
<B><A NAME="Resources">Resources</A></B>
<BR>
<UL TYPE=square>
<LI><A NAME=Baldwin> </A>Baldwin, R. (2004) Classical Greece. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://socsci.gulfcoast.edu/rbaldwin/classical_greece.htm" TARGET="new">http://socsci.gulfcoast.edu/rbaldwin/classical_greece.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Casad> </A>Casad, A. (n.d.) The Sexual State of Human Nature. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.nd.edu/~acasad/papers/WARR_11B_2.pdf" TARGET="new">http://www.nd.edu/~acasad/papers/WARR_11B_2.pdf</A>
<LI><A NAME=Copeland> </A>Copeland, J. (1997) Heidi Fleiss Gets 3 Years. E! Online News. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,534,00.html" TARGET="new">http://www.eonline.com/News/Items/0,1,534,00.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=David> </A>David, S. (n.d.) The Specifities of Female Drug Addiction. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.drugtext.org/library/articles/peddr0033.htm" TARGET="new">http://www.drugtext.org/library/articles/peddr0033.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Decriminalize> </A>Decriminalize Prostitution Now Coalition (2000): What Countries Have Legal Prostitution? Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.sexwork.com/coalition/whatcountrieslegal.html" TARGET="new">http://www.sexwork.com/coalition/whatcountrieslegal.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Divorce> </A>Divorce Magazine (n.d.) U.S. Divorce Statistics. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml" TARGET="new">http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml</A>
<LI><A NAME=Gavin> </A>Gavin, K. (2001) News Release: Women need testing and care for infection that can steal fertility. University of Michigan Health System. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.med.umich.edu/opm/newspage/2001/chlam.htm" TARGET="new">http://www.med.umich.edu/opm/newspage/2001/chlam.htm</A>
<LI><A NAME=Google> </A>Google (2003) Search Engine. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://news.google.com/news?q=massage+parlor" TARGET="new">http://news.google.com/news?q=massage+parlor</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=catholic+church+pedophilia">http://www.google.com/search?q=catholic+church+pedophilia</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=swaggart+Debra+Murphree" TARGET="new">Jimmy Swaggart and Prostitute Debra Murphree</A> & <A HREF="http://www.google.com/search?q=jim+bakker+jessica+hahn" TARGET="new">Jim Bakker and Church Secretary Jessica Hahn</A>
<LI><A NAME=Hughs> </A>Hughs, J. (1990) Monogamy as a Prisoners Dilemma: Non-Monogamy as a Collective Action Problem. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.changesurfer.com/Acad/Monogamy/Mono.html" TARGET="new">http://www.changesurfer.com/Acad/Monogamy/Mono.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Liberator> </A>The Liberator (2004) Official Website. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://www.liberator.net/" TARGET="_top">http://www.liberator.net/</A>
<LI>Malick, A. (n.d.) Humans Emit Sex Signals. Accessed Online on December 2004 at: <A HREF="http://preventdisease.com/news/articles/humans_emit_sex_signals.shtml" TARGET="new">http://preventdisease.com/news/articles/humans_emit_sex_signals.shtml</A>
<LI><A NAME=McElroy> </A>McElroy, W. (1999) Prostitution: Reconsidering Research. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://zetetics.com/mac/articles/spin1199.html" TARGET="new">http://zetetics.com/mac/articles/spin1199.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Mechelen> </A>Mechelen, R. (1992) Prostitution. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.backlash.com/book/prostit.html" TARGET="new">http://www.backlash.com/book/prostit.html</A>
<LI><A NAME=Nation> </A>Nation Master (n.d.): Statistics Retriever. Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.nationmaster.com/" TARGET="new">http://www.nationmaster.com/</A>
<LI><A NAME=Nixon> </A>Nixon, N. (2001) Bootlegging In Illinois: bathtub gin and the whole shootin' match. Illinois Periodicals Online (NIU). Accessed Online on November 2003 at: <A HREF="http://www.lib.niu.edu/ipo/ic010410.html" TARGET="new">http://www.lib.niu.edu/ipo/ic010410.html</A>
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MURAMASA
2009-09-23, 09:41 AM
Enough with the name-calling.
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-23, 09:44 AM
whatever lil bitch :P
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-23, 10:47 AM
Look into 3rd wave feminism reading, there are well educated and successful women with pasts and presents as sex workers that have sanity with differing moral codes.
One that comes to mind immediately is "Janes Sexes It Up" by Merri Lisa Johnson (aka - Former Stripper with a phd). And that same writer was also involved in "Flesh for Fantasy", which was written in full by a GROUP of ex-sex workers that are also academics.
And there was recently, as in the past 2-3 years, a heavy trendy of memoirs put out there by sex workers. Typically found in either the Women's studies or Sociology section of book stores.
Also, there are plenty of documentaries out there. "Live Nude Girls Unite" was a fascinating documentary on the attempts of dancers for unionization - which I fully support. And while I don't know of any right off, I'm sure that there's plenty of books or documentaries on the Dominatrix biz.
I don't think that anyone in this thread is trying to glamorize the industry. But you can't completely generalize it as being a negative and utterly destructive thing either.
I can't -completely- generalize it, but I can come pretty close. As I've said, there seem to be a lot more issues created than are worth it for "consensual sex between adults". And I can't be persuaded to think of prostitution as a victimless crime.
The books/documentaries that I've seen are largely about the negative impacts of prostitution. Unionizing of strippers doesn't strike me as for, or against, as such, just for protecting the women that strip. And, given that being a stripper is legal, and that hasn't solved all the problems stippers face (poor treatment by managers, drug addiction, the tendancy to be unable to quit stripping and/or moving on to prostitution), I really fail to see how legalizing prostitituion would result in anything different.
And again, seeing here what decriminalization of prostitution has caused (and it's not really legal or decriminalized here, the culture is just such that cops are largely crooked and are paid to look the other way) makes me not want America, or any city in it, to become anything like Pattaya. Not one fishnet clad toe's worth.
buzzboy
2009-09-23, 05:57 PM
What *I* don't get is if you pay one person for sex it's prostitution, but if you pay them both and put them in front of a camera, it's porn and legal.
i've wondered that before. also, also i'm fairly certain some people start porn production companies just so they can bang all the young talent and make money selling the tapes of it after.
I'm actually pretty certain its a matter of tax dollars. A porn production company is an incorporated business that pays taxes on revenue. A prostitute generally does not. Unless its in nevada.
Master Miguel Lush
2009-09-23, 06:06 PM
i'm fairly certain some people start porn production companies just so they can bang all the young talent and make money selling the tapes of it after.
are there any other reasons???????
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-23, 06:14 PM
i've wondered that before. also, also i'm fairly certain some people start porn production companies just so they can bang all the young talent and make money selling the tapes of it after.
I'm actually pretty certain its a matter of tax dollars. A porn production company is an incorporated business that pays taxes on revenue. A prostitute generally does not. Unless its in nevada.
It's because ostensibly, you're paying porn artists to film them fucking, and not paying them to fuck.
That's a really fine line, to be sure, but are any porn artists walking the streets for business? The secondary effects are very limited, compared to outright prostitution.
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-23, 06:47 PM
PhD in HUMAN SEXUALITY from the Institute of Advanced Study of Human Sexuality.
Reading is fundamental.
It is. You should learn how to.
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y218/PhoenixPie/Picture4.png
http://www.anniesprinkle.org/media/dissertation.pdf
TokyoSurprise
2009-09-23, 06:51 PM
In places where it is legal, the health of prostitutes is overseen by the government and they are required to get regularly tested for STDs and are medically supervised, thus helping stop the spread of disease. There are no "pimps" or criminal elements involved. The government also collects taxes from them, thus helping the economy. Also, with it being legal, the women/men engaging in the acts do not have to hide it, and thus can be made safer by not having to perform acts in places such as alleys, on the streets, in cars, etc.
In places where it is illegal, it is a "black market" commodity... with this, comes more crime, much like the with drugs being illegal. Since it is illegal, there is no legal recourse for things such as non payment, they are not required by law to get regularly tested for STDs, and they do not pay taxes.
By keeping it illegal and underground, it does more harm than good to society. By attempting to stop it, it brings in criminal elements, such as pimps, the mafia, etc. who beat the women if they dont pay their percentages for "protection", abuse them, and even go as far as murdering them. In addition, having it illegal aids the illegal slave trade and women being sold into sex trafficking.
Exploitation from pimps disappears with the legalization of prostitution.
Also, according to Paul Abramson, Ph.D., Steven Pinkerton, Ph.D., and Mark Huppin, J.D., Ph.D., who all wrote in "Sexual America":
Unionizing of strippers doesn't strike me as for, or against, as such, just for protecting the women that strip. And, given that being a stripper is legal, and that hasn't solved all the problems stippers face (poor treatment by managers, drug addiction, the tendancy to be unable to quit stripping and/or moving on to prostitution), I really fail to see how legalizing prostitituion would result in anything different.
.
The Logic Theorist
2009-09-24, 01:47 AM
It also just struck me that the whole concept of the high class hooker, of selling sex and sexuality being empowering to women (and not the men who buy them) is a concept that's relatively recent. It was created, marketed, and sold, by...
Hugh Heffner and Playboy.
A guy that wanted to see a lot of women naked has convinced the feminists that getting naked for money is in their best interest. That might possibly be the most brilliant scam of the century.
buzzboy
2009-09-24, 08:35 PM
It also just struck me that the whole concept of the high class hooker, of selling sex and sexuality being empowering to women (and not the men who buy them) is a concept that's relatively recent. It was created, marketed, and sold, by...
Hugh Heffner and Playboy.
A guy that wanted to see a lot of women naked has convinced the feminists that getting naked for money is in their best interest. That might possibly be the most brilliant scam of the century.
word. I persoanlly think its an illusion. I really doubt that while a guy is handing a chick 4k an hour he is thinking "wow, what a strong empowered woman" he is prolly thinking...."i bet if i offer up another 2k i can cum in her ass"